I don’t have time to follow every region so tell me which teams to look out for. I’m already familiar with the likely top 3 in each region
— but I wanna know who you think are Dark Horses that could qualify to internationals next year!
You can also contest my top 3 picks but tell me why you think your picks are better!
LOUD has a good core in Pancada, Cauanzin, and Tuyz for sure. I just doubt the other two because Dgzin is known to be toxic and V1nny has mediocre stats. Maybe I’m missing something?
GX has great talent in Cloud, Purp0, and Tomaszy — but Runner seems like a massive weak link to me.
I’m worried about SPG post Neon nerfs. Is Dambi good on other entries?
I don’t really know anything about the Wolves players but I know TMV is super hype about them. Which of them should I look out for?
Loud’s biggest issue last year IMO was a weak duelist, role issues, and not having a great approach to the game after their phoenix/double flash style fell out. Picking up an insanely mechanical duelist and a new igl for a new approach is exactly the changes they need. I like to believe dgzin has had time to work on his toxicity and will be better.
Runner being a weak link is just wrong, he had a great first year as a rookie, made champs and played 2 different roles. I think he’s finding himself and he’ll be more confident next year now that he has experience.
Dambi is 100% good on other duelists if you look back at their games. I don’t have many concerns, that team is easily top 3 in my eyes next year.
Wolves picked up Juicy from DSG one of the best apac prospects and they were already winning games and events before he got picked up. Spring is really good but plays duelist too so not sure if both will play.
I’m not familiar with V1nny’s IGLing but I’ll keep an eye out since you’re good for it. Hoping Dgzin is better too since I think Pancada deserves a solid team after what happened with SEN.
I totally forgot Runner swapped roles and his sentinel play is probably why I’ve been doubting him. You’re probably right.
I’m surprised you’re so high on SPG! Their game against BOOM was pretty close and kinda had me setting them as middle-of-pack team. Do you truly believe they’ll beat T1, DRX, Talon, and DFM and get top 3?
I know Juicy is from Singapore and Mandarin is the most common language there so it should be seamless. Curious what their roles will be though — maybe a full time Iso? Should be exciting!
Yeah I can't say for sure about V1nny's calling but he has a lot of experience in Brazilian t2 and again I think LOUD just needed a new approach after last year. A lot of people are writing off Brazilian teams/KRU for next year but I don't think the gap will be huge like it was in 2024. There's an Brazilian offseason tournament next week so we'll get a really good idea of how their looking then.
SPG is the only team out of ascension that kept their full roster together. I can see a similar situation to G2 last year where the chemistry sets them ahead of the pack more than people might think.
The language barrier is definitely a concern for Wolves but we've seen time and time again import players come into China and perform extremely well so I'm not super worried about it.
from what i've heard (and seen on his vlr stats) he's pretty good at both jett and raze too, probably can make it work
runner was definitely meh last year but after his role swap to initiator during the recent off season tournaments he's looked pretty decent so im holding out hope, GX definitely looks pretty solid
Second time seeing GX and Wolves.
I’ve got mixed feelings about KRU. They’ve got six on their roster right now but I think they’re dropping mta for adverso right? Who is going to be the IGL and can Keznit, Mazino, and Shyy make up for the other two?
DFM’s off-season makes them look promising but I haven’t had the chance to watch their matches. Which players should I look out for besides Meiy, and who’s the IGL?
Oh, the face of DFM will always be Meiy. Though I think Akame will be a close second if this off-season performance translates into the main season. Honestly, just be hyped for all of them - even Art. The Odin is cringe, but he is a smart player to use it whilst it's strong especially in conjunction with Sova.
Americas:100t, Kru
100T: Looked very up and down last season but in the ups they were looking like a genuine world class top team. Addition of Zander I imagine will help a lot with some mid-round calls and generally lift the burden on Boostio to hard IGL everything. Bit of weird drama with salaries and the off season loss but based on what I saw from them in real matches last year they will be going to at least 1 international this year or better
Kru: Not really a keznit fan tbh but they dominated a good portion of the regular season domestically in Americas. Now that he doesn't have a brazilian to hate maybe he will be a little happier and bring the team vibes up idk but overall solid players and the addition of Mazino from Lev should be fire since he really was not the problem on Lev
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EMEA:
KC - I struggled to pick a dark horse from EMEA really - my only real "dark horse" would have been FUT but you listed them already. KC seem like a really cool roster with one of the best IGLs ever relocating from Americas to EMEA just for this team. Couple it with ol' reliable Suygetsu the cracked aimer and some other cool prospects and they could fry. Though their off season performances thus far have been very lackluster so I'm really not sure but they should be fun to watch at least
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APAC: TS, DFM
TS: Big underdog pick here but they were a top 3 regular season APAC team and have consistently been one of APAC's better teams. They lost to Talon in the single-elim portion of the playoffs right after they got Primmie. I think they're due for making an international they are genuinely a very good underdog team who always perform well in APAC - they even beat GenG and PRX last year domestically
DFM: Very cool new roster with a lot more firepower building around Meiy. Saw a glimpse of them recently in this off season event where they got some great results over PRX, EDG, Trace and RRQ (Lost rematch to PRX grand final) 10/10 would recommend
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CN:
Wolves - Looked good in the off season events and picked up some promising players - including now Juicy? which is a little weird but whatever works
Hey, appreciate the effort you put in to explain your picks!
How much does their match against Trust in Plug sway you? I know 100T has good talent and a world class IGL but I’m unsure whether the map pool will suit them; fewer Jett maps and Asuna looks rather uncomfortable on Neon. I worry for them given how competitive Americas looks.
If not FUT, who would you have had in your top 3? Also, KC is such a good shout and I know Engh and Saadhak are going to absolutely cook. I’m high on Elite but I’m concerned about Marteen’s inconsistency and how Suygetsu will adapt to Smokes. Maybe they’ll have everything sorted for Split 2?
What do you think makes TS so inconsistent? Some matches they’ll upset favorites and others they’ll just flop. I’ve been high in Invy for a while but I don’t watch enough of them to pinpoint why they just never seem to qualify for internationals. I’ll try to root for them with you though; we love an underdog story!
Keep seeing the Wolves hype! How far up do you think they’ll punch — past FPX?
The off season 1 match vs Trust in Plug doesn't sway me at all really. Off season events are great fun and good for trying things out but from everything i've seen the correlation is very weak between dominating the off-season and actually winning. Sen did it last year I suppose but there aren't many examples. The literal #1 team in the world EDG have been getting spanked this off-ssn. If they bombed out of a double elimination off-season tournament or went 0-2 in a round robin maybe a little but it really was just 1 random bo3 and not even on LAN while putting cryo on cypher
For EMEA without FUT I would probably edge FNC into my top 3. I think they're on the decline (or maybe everyone else is on the up + learned how to beat them) but they are still a great team with cracked players who know how to stay calm and win
TS imo stylistically match up very well with the hyper-aggressive APAC style. Even though they don't really have any star players they slow the game down and punish the aggression from most other APAC teams and play fundamentally sound valorant. A bit like DRX only with less firepower but a bit more creativity and spark on attack.
I think FPX had one of the harshest years last year basically always matching up with teams like GenG, Heretics, Sen (not just at champs but masters as well) so probably Wolves won't overtake them. If anything I can see FPX maybe making a deep run at one of the masters events and Wolves may qualify for 1 of them
Your replies in this thread are very positive and encouraging it's refreshing to see people with this kind of energy online
Appreciate it dude!
It seems like I’ve put too much weight into the off-season and teams will probably sort out most of their issues once the regular season starts.
Do you think TS would have more success if they referenced Americas teams that have history crushed APAC aggression? I wonder if they could pick up G2’s disciplined style to make up for their lack of star players?
i think avez played for nasr or smth and performed pretty well aside from a few off games, as a flex player he should be a pretty good fit because that may allowed Suygetsu to play more of secondary smokes maybe as he is more comfortable with viper for example. should be a good addition to the team but we'll have to see how much he will be able to contribute to the team and hopefully help KC become one of the better teams in the league, overall KC is already in the better half of the EMEA league and is very stacked on paper with Saadhak and Suygetsus' experience, marteen is able to come alive on quite a few occasions and Elite has played consistently throughout the year on BBL (altho the team didn't do that well). Definitely looking forward to see how they do as I am a huge Suygetsu supporter and was pretty disappointed with how NAVI performed this year (it looked like there were many internal issues tbh)
Damn you’re a real underdog connoisseur.
I can see the EG Hopium with Yay, Supamen, DERREK and Potter but I don’t see this roster being consistent enough to compete for the top slots of the league. There’s an even lesser argument for 2GE.
I know KOI has two strong pillars in Sheydos and Grubinho but the question remains in whether Filu can translate his Ascension performance to T1 and whether Flyuh can adapt. I’m really hoping that role switch for their KC show match is off-season only though because Flyuh is not a smokes player but a flex instead. Fingers crossed.
I know literally nothing about RRQ. I’ve heard some hype for them from Platchat but it always falls flat. Why are you high on them?
XLG seriously bothers me. They had to choose between their cracked duelist or their cracked IGL and they chose the former. Why are you rating them?
Well your post only state qualifying to international so if they are lucky one of these teams atleast make it to one master event
EG just need a good duelist, sym clearly outmatched by others tier 1 duelist right now. Honestly they should replace nature, he seems underwhelming most of the time. Nowdays you need IGL with good aim
Flyuh and filu might be their weakest link but the other 3 is solid. Also dont forget they add a new coach from vitality, so bet on that.
The thing is about RRQ, they keep improving and almost went to champs but got the short end of the stick. They just need one more win or 1 more master point to qualify but that 1 crucial win is against GenG lol. RRQ is like old PRX, they do have crack aimers but lack creative insane setup play.
Im pretty sure kr1stal himself want to leave regardless if they win ascension or not.
Well they placed 4th on their 'first' tournament vs all the chinese teams, granted the top 2 china team doesnt participate but still. So in a short amount of time they do a decent job so far.
I’ve heard rumors that EG are picking up Icy. Do you think he’s good enough to get them across the line? If not, who else should they consider?
I didn’t know KOI picked up Vitality’s coach! It seems he was responsible for their Split 2 and Champs run, likely with the Sayf/Runner role swaps. He’s got a pretty extensive background huh.
Hearing that RRQ is similar to old PRX doesn’t fill me with much hope. The game has progressed to a point where everyone is familiar with inducing mistakes from hyper-aggression and punishing double duelist comps. It seems like their pick up of a dedicated scan initiator (Kush) might make up the difference though.
I didn’t know that Kr1stal wanted to leave himself but I supposed that makes sense since he joined GE. I’ll keep an eye out for XLG though — any specific player stand out?
AM: MIBR
Lowkey, they can make some noise. aspas is aspas, cortezia and xenom are very mechanically talented, nzr is a solid mechanical IGL, and they still have fRod who created a good system.
EMEA: GX
I'm getting major GUILD 2022 vibes from this team. They are all talented but they need that extra push to do better.
PAC: DFM
I thought ZETA would be the better JP team, but nah, DFM are frying rn. They have shooters, their playstyle is really cohesive, and Art is a great caller. Obviously, it all depends whether gyen can keep up with SSeeS' performance.
CN: WOL
I've been a big Spring believer since his NIP days, and it's finally the year he can have proper support and be a system player. Juicy and Lysoar are great pickups, but it all depends who plays controller. Still, they can probably go to a masters if everything works out.
I’ve got nothing to say about DFM and Wolves. They’re obvious Dark Horses by community consensus it seems!
MIBR reminds me of NRG in terms of its roster construction with 3 experienced players and two star talents. My major concern is that I’m unfamiliar with Nzr as an IGL and both Xenom and Cortezia are Smokes players. They lack a flash initiator/flex and it’s possible that Aspas won’t get the support he needs.
GX has potential but I still see them as a feast or famine roster that’s more likely to be the “Dalton Line” for EMEA. If you’re better than them then you have a chance to qualify but otherwise you’re mid. I don’t quite see it man.
I’m still unconvinced by them. Their Shanghai run relied heavily on their uncontested Bind while their other maps were clearly less polished. At the same time, their role swaps are MESSY.
I’ve yet to see a team that has their star player flex 3 different roles with both the flex and IGL also having to flex for 2. It technically works out for their comps but undoubtably impacts their maps where they’re off primary comfort roles.
What makes you confident in them?
i also don't trust keiko and kamo, nats and patitek are still likely very solid from the 2024 season with Kamyk also performing decently but yeah, the other two have me concerned because kamo will have alot of pressure on him as a duelist player and he didn't fare that well with KOI and with keiko switching to flex i believe? how will he fare bc he performed very inconsistently through the season. but yeah im also curious what makes liquid a dark horse? do they really have an actual chance to make a run?
Kinda wild that FNC is no longer considered Top 3 in EMEA, but I can see concerns as to why. Boaster not fragging enough, Leo is still inactive on recovery from Long COVID, Kaajak didn't perform to his best at RBHG. If Leo does come back, I think FNC is Top 3. And as for an EMEA underdog, I think M8s can be good if RobbieBk and Click can perform to a high quality. Likewise, GX have potential to be top tier if tomaszy and runner can peform consistently.
In Americas, SEN definitely feel overrated at least with their current role issues. I think they need to swap N4RRATE and JohnQT's roles if they want to see the best results. Americas' underdog will be MIBR or 2Game. MIBR have injected a lot of firepower and Aspas wanted to play with Nzr so there must be some insane chemistry there. 2Game have been written off just because they're the newly ascended team, but I think what they can bring is a lot of aggression and confidence. Having said this, Spike was key in this plan. Hopefully gobera will be fine. If not 2Game, KRU always have a chance at making Champs. It's just their destiny. Also, LEV should be in the Top 3 contention.
APAC underdogs will be either DFM or RRQ. Kush on RRQ looks insane. High potential player especially if Jemkin and Monyet are also playing great. Xffero is their current weak point, but I think he is sure to improve as the season goes on. DFM are amazing if their off-season is anything to go off of. My one concern is gyen is young and thus doesn't have that experience that SSeeS has. SSeeS has both amazing aim and a sixth sense to win certain rounds. People write him off for the previous season but he was arguably second best behind Meiy.
In China, it's probably either Wolves or XLG that are gonna have that underdog run. Of course, BLG is close fourth to the Top 3, but Wolves have a fair bit of firepower and XLG look promising for an ascension team. Hopefully it won't be another DRG-style hit 1 tournament and fizzle out.
So M8 is Click, RobbieBK, K4davra, Zyppan, and Profek. Who is switching to sentinel and where do you think their floor is? It feels like a lot of teams in EMEA can punch up but I have no idea what to expect from their respective average performances.
I agree with your Sen take but I don’t know why you’re high on LEV. The Demon1/Natank duo makes sense for their roles but I really need to see them at the riot games one tournament to get the hype.
My money is on DFM!
How would you rank the top China teams altogether?
I believe Minny is on sentinel (PROFEK is on BBL). It was his role on GoNext. I'm not sure what you mean by "their floor" unless you mean their lowest performance. Their worst is obviously getting rolled because they let maps slip away just like the 2024 season. The expectation after the 2024 season is basically anyone can scalp a surprise win off of anyone. We saw it with BBL, M8, KC, GX.
Now, the reason I am high on LEV is that they are a strong team even if they lose Aspas and Mazino. There will always be what-if's on Demon1 since he showed only 50% of his performance on NRG and he can do the same on LEV. Natank is an interesting player and with the Sage and Phoenix buffs, he can be an interesting flex player. Natank was pretty much the best player on M8s and only Kadavra really surprised me on that team asides Natank. Definitely gotta see what they have cooked at RIOT One.
EDG is still gonna be far and away the best Chinese team. FPX kinda floundered at Champs despite having incredible firepower and nearly beating Heretics. I would still put them in contention as second-best with TE very close behind if not overtaking. BLG is kind of a firm 4th place team, but I think my mind could be changed if Wolves live up to the hype. Honestly, it's a similar situation to EMEA where any of the lower teams can scalp a win and perhaps sneak an appearance at Masters/Champs.
Ah, I mixed up BBL with M8 while going over rosters. When I brought up “floor” I meant what’s the expected placement if their players are performing to their baselines instead of going nuclear. Like I can’t see G2 dropping below top 6 in Americas if they just meet their expected minimum.
I didn’t realize how similar all the leagues are when it comes to how competitive the middle tier of teams are. Everyone has a chance to qualify to Champs. I’m gonna steal your word choice of “scalping”!
Yeah, I would say M8 minimum performance is gonna be around the bottom. They have good aimers, but it's a matter of strategy and IGLing. RobbieBk did decently in Tier 2 and the key benefit he has for M8 is he plays Sova well enough. If his IGLing is sustainable in Tier 1 alongside some coaching from Goked, they should be winning.
DRX is an interesting case. I don’t see them beating their other Korean brethren but I’ve heard that Hyunmin and Freeing are extremely hot prospects. What am I missing that makes you think they could be dark horses?
TE seem like a feast or famine team with great upset potential. Kai and LuoK1ng are heavy fraggers but I’m worried about Biank since he’s so inconsistent.
The only two that im sure are G2 and NRG. Sen it's a strong team and they probably will be there but outside of the firepower i can see them melting down losing two really big psychological and tactical leaders of the team, adding with N4rrate and Bang having weak mental and some weird role issues. I don't really trust Lev for a number of reasons, MIBR will be shaky at the beggining of the season but probably will be great by the end, and 100T and Kru are both a coinflip. I can see teams like Loud, Furia (which is terribly underrated) EG and even 2G sneaking in if they play the game right. Only one i can't see doing it is C9 and even then they have this weird groupstage buff sometimes and classify out of nowhere
As far as I last heard, the roster is:
Is that correct? And if so, I have serious reservations about Havoc entirely and Heat on Sentinel. The former is a serial underperformer and the latter should be on initiator. Make it make sense to me please.
Havoc is a mid flash initiator and a mid sentinel, his best performances were on 2023 playing duelist under the union (with raafa and peu) so if he's going to play better, this is the time, as for heat, i think they'll use this off-season to test him on sentinel and if it goes wrong he'll probably change roles with raafa, i think he'll be fine playing sentinel though
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