Cut that shit, y'all acting like those trash clickbait content creators on YT or Tiktok.
Most vlr users that I've seen who actually engages on KR team matches and content stay reserved, while these randos come out and parrot the same shit. "KR supermacy, domination, pac fucked, yadayada". I don't know, maybe you guys are keep writing that shit to ragebait SEA and JP fans, who knows.
I think they are troll for sure and most of them are bandwagoners too. And few are league fans who want to see kr and china at the top like in lol. It's similar with edg as well. But at least the china situation isn't as bad as kr yet.
Too many diabetic patients in vlr with how much they glaze kr and edg. At least stop hating on other regions using the success of edg or kr.
Also Just imagine if jp teams were as good as kr or cn in PC eSports as whole and val too. the vlr would be filled completely with jp glaze posts by the weebs. Thank god that's not really the case even though I want zeta to do well.
they arent - korea was worse than SEA in vct until 2024, literally 2024 is the only year since what 2021? where korea was doing better than sea internationally
Boom and bleed made ascension finals, a japanese team and 1 korean team, I mean the korean ascension team literally lost to oceania in 2023
Korea has 4 teams in VCT, and thats about right, these 4 teams are not perfect, all of them COULD improve, so why act like theres just 15 more tier 1 korean players, when theres max about 4-5
before the inception of franchising it is too difficult to tell which regions are better because we only saw a few good teams from each region and neither SEA nor KR had placements particularly outshining the other
but in 2023 the top 4 teams during pacific league were PRX, DRX, T1, and GENG. that's KR being better as a region. in 2024 again all 3 KR teams made internationals and only 2 SEA teams out of like 6 i think. and now while 2025 jus started KR is just better again.
even so i only argued that KR was the best region rn and said i liked it (cus im lit korean) so idk why ur on my dick
i dont deny that, i just think at the moment the korean representation is more than enough
20 player slots to represent a region with one trophy is more than enough, especially because the best korean team got worse in the offseason
plus it could go to 25 player slots next year, this is a healthy balance between giving korean talents enough shine, and not overpopulating the region with koreans who really dont deserve to be tier 1 because the goal of franchising is to win masters or champions, not dominate global esports in league matches
if the only matches teams play were league matches, id agree
20 player slots to represent a region with one trophy is more than enough, especially because the best korean team got worse in the offseason
this is fair but that region is the only region in the continental league with a trophy
but also the original comment was saying that korea is by far the best
idk about by far, actually back in 2023 all 3 korean teams were in the top 4 of pacific. 2024 geng and drx were 1st and 2nd, now we have all 3 occupying 1st~3rd, and nongshim is already looking like the 4th~5th best.
so nothing has really changed that much. korea has been the best region in pacific since franchising, the only reason it wasn't domination was because prx existed.
representation atp is earned through ascension, so...but there's undeniable proof of good tier 2 korean talent. the best duelist in korean tier 2 during 2023 was stew and the guy had to go to china because there was no korean team willing to free up their duelist spot for him. shit even sayaplayer is in japanese tier 2
SEA teams own fault tbh. They are picking up koreans because 1. Its cheaper, 2. more professional. Apparently most of the sea t2 orgs have insane buyouts on their players. But the reality is korean pros are becoming superior in pacific atm. SEA needed to level the playing field and they did after getting kush and primmie but we need more from them. Cause korea aint stopping anytime they will only keep getting better
I would heavily disagree. SEA as a region was never better than KR.
Here are some potential arguments you might claim that I will refute:
"Well, the t2 region is better in SEA than KR."
In 2021 and 2025, this is not true. In 2023/2024, yes! however, kr had 3 teams in partnership 2023 and beyond while being a singular country.
the only exception here is 2022, where I believe that the t2 region was definitely stacked in SEA's favor, and this was before partnership.
"teams are split right now, so KR in general is mid."
dude, 3/4 teams that have been split are in the top 4 rn, with our fourth placing top 6 on their first tier 1 tourney.
"Korean ascension team lose to OCE in '23"
...so we're just nitpicking. they were (arguably) the favorites alongside BLD to win APAC ascension, and they even beat BLD. its just that DK are known chokers KEKW
I don't think that's a good argument in general.
"these 4 teams are not perfect"
and look at the SEA teams. while no team is perfect, its visible (whether you look at the gameplay or the stats in map win % or whos left in the tourney) that KR currently has a more refined playstyle that works in this current meta. they have controlled macro, and solid fundamentals.
"so why act like theres just 15 more tier 1 korean players, when theres max about 4-5"
you might be insane for saying this. I'm rarely pissed at any take, but this might take the cake. i might sound very aggressive, but this just shows how little you know about APAC t2 in general. On the top of my head, I can already list current VCT KR players that were merely prospects/no-names that yall didn't know, including: Akame (DFM) Jinboong (DFM) UdoTan (GE) HYUNMIN (DRX) free1ng (DRX) yoman (GEN) AND all of NS
and the year before? we had a literal ranked player Karon (GEN) become the best smokes player of 2024! this doesn't even include stew from VCT CN (JDG) BeYN (DRX) Flashback (DRX) iZu (T1) Estrella (RRQ)
ill even toss in prospects right now for '26: Gwangboong (SG, twin of Jinboong) ZynX (DRX.A) LOB (SZ) DH (T1.A) exa (T1.A) GangPin (T1.A) TenTen (T1.A) pr0xy (MARU) and I'm pretty sure I'm missing most of the KR prospects in VCT CN and JP t2.
Sayaplayer is not even rostered, and Xross (NS) hasn't even seen play yet!
so please tell me how your overarching point makes sense. if we're merely going by a top-heavy standard, you only have PRX, which pales to the sheer amount of placements that VS/DRX and now GEN, with a side of T1 that has been made.
this is one of the few times I will say that someone is objectively wrong. insane. sorry in advance if I might've came out too strong.
look bro, i read this, you make good points but theres no way you can possibly justify the notion that korean teams need more than 20 slots
I get theres korean talent, but even right now, none of these korean teams are going to compete to win bangkok, T1 was playing very close to talon, these are NOT dominant teams in apac.. last year, id agree, geng was dominant but none of the current KR teams are amazing, they could all use roster changes before even getting around to adding another kr team
heres the good news, if korea really is the best region, there is a chance they go to 5 teams this year, if san prisa goes to champs, boom will be relegated and a korean team will be able to earn another slot
my main point wasn't really about justifying the need to add more slots. I've never said anything that supports the NEED to. in fact, I'm against having more than 5 teams max. its good for the scene and will ensure that we don't have another scene like LoL, even if I usually don't care for diversity bullshit and equity bullshit. (btw the notion of equity is overrated and garbage, there are better ways in all systems like the workplace, schooling, and in this case VCT, to implement a diaspora of cultures)
with the SEA fanbase (half-rightfully, as some individuals make good points while the others mald just because of racist reasons, nonsensical/nonexistent problems, or the fact that its "unhealthy for the environment") bitching about KR (again, its the loud minority, I know plenty of SEA fans that are really chill), it's really hard to not get defensive as a Korean myself and a VCT KR devote, again, with some of the reasons I see circulating.
nothing against you as a person, hope this doesn't leave a bad impression on me or VCT KR in general.
you listed one team. ONE team.
i know i said a lot, but please care to read what I've said previously: "if we're merely going by a top-heavy standard, you only have PRX, which pales to the sheer amount of placements that VS/DRX and now GEN, with a side of T1 that has been made." And yes, even in 2023, since yes, PRX got an impressive 2nd place finish, but DRX also got a 3rd-4th place finish in LOCK//IN, and don't forget that the top 3 teams in APAC were PRX, DRX, and T1 (in 2023)
I'm not talking about the whole year. If we consider the entire year, I would still say SEA was a little better, but that depends on personal bias. That's why I said 'moment' because there was definitely a time when SEA was better. PRX won the Pacific League, placed 3rd at Masters, and finished 2nd at Champs, while DRX placed in the top 6, and T1 never made it out of groups. Team Secret also beat GENG in LCQ and secured 2nd place. That’s when SEA was better—during the middle and at the end of the 2023 season.
valid points, will take into account.
in hindsight my initial statement felt like an overreaction to the braindead takes I kept seeing
also, moments is a dangerous term, since what "counts" as a moment? In this case, you set the moment during late(ish) 2023, and yes, I will concede that SEA had better placements. however, in a given moment, you had KR players brewing at the time in tier 2, some rotting away. just think about all of the untapped potential KR had before 2024/25, its insane to see players like meteor get held back by players like TS, or players like free1ng (who's played in VCT KR since THE beginning) who've never got a chance until now.
This post is not really about the real Koreans. Most of the real Koreans are very chill in vlr and don't normally make posts over glazing kr and hating on other. Majority of people doing such are bandwagoners and koreaboos present in vlr. They have been using the name of kr to hate on other teams and regions and meatride kr which can be very annoying. The situation is similar to sen and prx fanbase. Also there are so many fake kr flaggers as well recently who use kr flag to troll on other regions.
about that... i can't speak for JP because I am Korean, but a huge part of the CN hate directed towards KR teams is because of their deep, entangled history in LoL. CN have often regarded KR teams (mainly T1/Faker and GEN/Chovy) as "THE" team(s) to beat, so I've heard from my Chinese friends that CN has a lot of both megafans and megahaters of T1/GEN.
hence why you saw Shanghai's crowd prejudiced against GEN; iirc they rooted for every team that went against GEN and T1 really strongly, and whenever GEN would clutch important rounds, you can hear the crowd suddenly fade into silence.
Korea pre partnership (21&22) only ever get 1 slot at internationals, whilst SEA occasionally gets 2 slots. If u can’t dethrone VS/DRX at the time (Nuturn/F4Q) other KR players really have no hope of making internationals to grow. The only other option was to join JP team, C9 Korea disband making NA team and Bazzi/Munchkin make internationals by joining Crazy Raccoon & Northeption Meteor.
Partnership is good for KR cause they have more opportunity to compete in international by competing straight with SEA teams in Pacific, not just with VS/DRX for measly 1 slot.
brother was not there to witness sea fans reactions to kr getting 3 slots. the kr fanboys are being annoying right now but a decent portion of sea fans deserve it ngl.
not to mention half of them can't even accept that their teams are just worse and are making tons of excuses about riot favoring kr (in reality sea has always been prioritized over kr for slots and the t2 changes are too recent to effect this tourney)
yeah icl the initial reaction to korea getting 3 slots even though sea got 4 was wild. at the time i didn't disagree completely, but was more upset about the orgs they chose (rip dplus)
it stems further back though, when sea fans were saying BOOM/SEA LCQ would sweep all the teams in the East Asia LCQ (so EDG and proto-Gen.G lol)
I agree those KR bandwagoners can be too much sometimes but you gotta understand that ppl do get disillusioned after being disappointed by their favourite teams year after year while KR teams and talents improved so much within such a short time.
With the current trend, SEA and JP orgs need to do way better else Pacific will just get dominated by KR orgs in the future.
I'm Thai but it's clear that KR is better than most teams in SEA atm. That's not saying the general mechanics and talent is better but they're LITERALLY just better teams in terms of macro, calling and strats. It is what it is. The lines are more blurred in Tier 2 of course but that's cause KR has like 4 teams already in Tier 1 with a player base arguably smaller than many sub-regions in APAC let alone the whole of SEA. We do not need foreign imports, we need foreign coaches to be integrated with local coaches which can then be passed down to the IGL and teammates. Once the whole team develops better fundamentals and understanding, APAC will literally be the most competitive region.
Mechanically, I think any sub-region in SEA has enough talents to compete at a tier 1 level and I'm gonna be biased and say that Thailand could at least have 3 rosters with the mechanical skill to compete at the tier 1 level and frag out. I also don't like recycle old guards who are past their prime, pick up the new, young talents and integrate them with a veteran who can provide leadership in the team. Now, what we lack generally is adaptability and true game understanding, a lot of SEA teams are always behind in the meta (we should be forcing Tejo by now and abuse the broken shit while we can!). Neon is nerfed yet Nongshim still force it because they know that's their strong suit and adapt their entire game plan around it.
KR has innovative coaches who cook (with comps and roles that generally make sense) and players usually have a good understanding of the game and don't overheat as well as solid IGLs. I think this is what distinguishes them the most and allows them to adapt and perform on the premier stage.
Also, for those Plat Chat enjoyers or anyone with a Western perspective, I encourage you to watch Tier 2 in APAC, KR and JP because those guys have no idea what goes on in this region. They know of T2 talents in other regions but since APAC is so large and dispersed, so many names go unheard of and are doubted almost immediately so they just want to recycle the same talents over and over. What KR has done well is bring up their Tier 2 players from academies and scouting and immediately integrating them into lineups so they're forced to 'grow up' and become a tier 1 player. This aggressive tactic may mean mediocre results at first (with exceptions) but ultimately it unlocks a whole new level of gameplay and mechanics.
You could make an argument that the environment is favourable to Koreans with the league being based in Korea allowing for Tier 2 and Tier 1 Korean teams to scrim openly as well as Korean teams normally being quite strict on having full Korean rosters to maintain synergy with players and coaches.
Good write up. Look at Primmie for example, unheard of until people started seeing him top ranked ladder games. There's always going to be talented players, but to incorporate them in a team setting successfully, that's a different story. I do however believe that with time, APAC as a whole will soon catch up to the rest of the world, they just have better overall work ethic, they just need the time to grow their macro, micro and strats.
As for KR, they're known to be all in for eSports, been since Starcraft days, so they'll always have the better infrastructure to thrive and succeed. Once other teams start pouring effort and money like that, they too will see success.
insightful (and thoughtful) response. I believe that Thailand has a ridiculous amount of potential right now (feels like the KR scene before it "boomed") and even though Vietnam is "dying" (e.g. YESicaN being wasted, other young talent not having the resources and needing to trailblaze), I strongly believe that they will make a magical resurgence over the next 4-5 years. give it time, they will shock the world once they get their hands on resources. Lastly, without memeing, I genuinely think that India will develop the necessary talent over time, but I think that it'll take 8+ years minimum, since India is a poor but developing country, with Indians having an unconscious bias and an image that gaming is not a sustainable industry. I REALLY love the ideology that GE's CEO is coming in with, and I desperately beg him to continue his endeavors, no matter how bleak it looks.
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