phoenix, gekko, sage, cypher

#1

bees

Devs said they're making changes to these agents.

What do y'all think we'll get?

#2

Aayan

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buff phx - make the wall go through stuff, maybe make the flash windup shorter or molly radius larger
nerf gekko - smaller molly (maybe increase time between it lands and does damage), make it so you can turn away from the flash, maybe give wingman less health
buff sage - maybe longer slow orb, longer lasting wall
nerf cypher - hardest one, defo something to do with the trip but idk what they could do without killing him

#4

CxsmicEntity

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They could make it like all other sentinels, it has a certain range you have to be in for the trip

#6

bees

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Devs said their vision was for cypher's niche to be the trip sentinel with unlimited range. I'd imagine they go for a nerf to his killing power rather than his info gathering.

#7

CxsmicEntity

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Maybe they'd debuff the time the player is stuck in the trip then? Or maybe that there's only one camera per game so that if its destroyed, it can't be replaced? Like KJ alarmbot? (Not sure about that)

#8

bees

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Yeah maybe. I hope we find out soon

#14

saebr

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both of those don't seem like bad changes for a nerf. good ideas!

#5

bees

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If cypher trip stops being a real-time ping and instead more like the cam ping I think it'll fine. Or maybe make it not re-arm if it's tripped by a player.

Sage is the tricker one I think. Devs specifically nerfed her slow orb because they thought it slowed down the pace of the game too much, but then at the same it's the only weak part of her kit that they can really change. I'm not sure what they'll do.

#9

CxsmicEntity

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They could also buff her heal back to what it was before, e.g. 70 player heal and 50 self-heal

#10

Aayan

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I think the re-arm would be too much of a nerf, but the cypher cam ping idea is nice, maybe also don't make it stun (or make the stun a one time thing), just make it ping as long as you're stuck inside of it. I completely agree it should be more info oriented and less for 'killing'

I think the pace of the game is less of an issue now than it was then, with things like neon being so common now I think it sort of offsets that, but they have more statistics than us so maybe

#13

bees

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At the end of the day he'll always have a niche as the only agent in the game with constant passive information. It's silly that he still has more killing power than the two sentinels who expressly trade info for more killing power.

#22

Two_Percent

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Never trust anyone who thinks phoenix wall should go through walls

#24

Aayan

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can you elaborate?

#25

Two_Percent

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He’s a duelist… the point of the wall isn’t to smoke of areas, it’s to cover yourself. Jett smokes don’t last for 15 seconds and have to be manually placed for a reason

#26

Aayan

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By that logic we should remove Neon's wall, Jett's smokes, and Iso's wall. Phoenix wall only lasts 8 seconds and has a limited range, it's only long enough to be used as an entry tool (Plus even if you consider the time it takes between placing it an swinging you've probably got an effective 6 seconds to use it). Not to mention all of the abilities I mentioned can go through walls/be curved around walls (Yes, even Neon's if there's a gap above). Unlike Jett smokes you can only buy one, which would bring it more in line with Neon and Iso

#27

Two_Percent

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that's not my point though??

#29

Prasinos

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Yes, nerf Gekko flash, my god, that blud cum was the most annoying thing ever in open maps.

#3

Kiko

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phoenix will become a bird and fly around with soldier ult

#11

m4

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Many of these agents people don't even play right. So they are likely going to dumb them down to the level to which people play at.

#12

bees

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Aside from cypher these are already some of the simplest agents

#18

m4

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statement still stands.

phx - people don't use wall for entry
gekko - people don't understand the delay on the flash
sage - people don't know the difference between concealment and cover
cypher - people use his trip as a universal alert but neglect the fact that multiple agents can bypass it without issue.

People are not smart. People want to use things the way they want to use things.

#19

bees

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You can say this about almost every agent in the game though. That doesn't mean riot will dumb them down to the level people play at with every change

#20

m4

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But Pros also don't understand these things. At what point are concepts too complex for their user base to decode. I mean how many still think that Deadlock trips should be played like Cypher trips? They think Cypher is a counter to Neon... The general community is cooked and show us on a daily basis.

#21

bees

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I think you have a blanket view on how everyone plays the game that isn't applicable to agent balance.

#23

Two_Percent

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People don’t understand the delay on the flash

Buddy it’s a number

#15

Agx192

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Phoenix will have a passive ability once every round when he dies he comes back but in spawn and with 1 hp

#16

bees

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Bro is playing spectre divide

#17

Hyxagon

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Buff Phoenix so that whenever he died he goes to the gulag and fights a Phoenix from another game and whoever wins comes back.

#28

IHaveAnswers

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Phoenix:
Molly - range increased from sova 1 bar --> 2 bar
Molly - radius increased +5
Wall - uptime increased by +5 sec
Wall - now applies a paranoia-like effect to enemies crossing it for short time
Ult - can now be cancelled

Sage:
Slow orb - fast throw like brim stim
Slow orb - duration increased +3 sec
Slow orb - slow effect increased, now applies as a gradient with it being strongest at center
Wall - length and width increased by +25%