if flor was a guy, yall would be galzing the shit out of him
generational talent idk why u dont see that
there is no world where icy can make it in t1 and flor cant
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sexism/transphobia
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goofyahh1447 [#3]flor would have to play in vct instead of fraud changers though
ppl were hyping up and glazing whzy for years when he was playing in china t2(so low skill level its crazy)
it is literally just sexism and transphobia
i think ppl are unironically too ass to realize how good she is
it's like a bell curve meme
the bottom end is "her mechanics are unreal"
the middle is the drooling guy "umm actually mechanics arent everything shes just farming bots"
the top end is "her mechanics are unreal"
- not a generational talent tho that goes to primmie
ButterflyEffect23 [#6]sorry if not anyone wants to gas up a tier-4 farmer
appreciate greatness
generational talent at the start of her career
thenutoriousPRO [#8]ppl were hyping up and glazing whzy for years when he was playing in china t2(so low skill level its crazy)
it is literally just sexism and transphobia
put any chinese player into GC and he's dropping 100 kills per bo3, lmao
ASTEROIDCHILD [#9]i think ppl are unironically too ass to realize how good she is
it's like a bell curve meme
the bottom end is "her mechanics are unreal"
the middle is the drooling guy "umm actually mechanics arent everything shes just farming bots"
the top end is "her mechanics are unreal"
- not a generational talent tho that goes to primmie
I feel like it’s more like
bottom end: people who don’t watch her, but hear about how she’s super good so they like her
middle: people who only watched her bad games or just look at how she performed in t2/3
top end: people who follow her, and realize that she’s legit pretty good
thenutoriousPRO [#10]appreciate greatness
generational talent at the start of her career
she's playing against plumbers AND she's got destroyed by another GC team(G2) WITH A MAP ADVANTAGE
what generational talent are you talking about, stop bouncing on her nuts, my goodness
ButterflyEffect23 [#11]put any chinese player into GC and he's dropping 100 kills per bo3, lmao
ok this is just wrong lol
i dont think you realize how ass chinese t2 is lol
genuinely think na radiant ranked is harder
thenutoriousPRO [#8]ppl were hyping up and glazing whzy for years when he was playing in china t2(so low skill level its crazy)
it is literally just sexism and transphobia
chinese t2 is miles better than gc lmfao
thenutoriousPRO [#8]ppl were hyping up and glazing whzy for years when he was playing in china t2(so low skill level its crazy)
it is literally just sexism and transphobia
yeah and then whyz goes on to absolutely dominate the second best NA team at champs in 2023, what's your point?
DBStudios [#17]yeah and then whyz goes on to absolutely dominate the second best NA team at champs in 2023, what's your point?
flor will do the same
thenutoriousPRO [#15]ok this is just wrong lol
i dont think you realize how ass chinese t2 is lol
genuinely think na radiant ranked is harder
damn chinese t2 is so bad whzy shat on nrg twice!
ASTEROIDCHILD [#9]i think ppl are unironically too ass to realize how good she is
it's like a bell curve meme
the bottom end is "her mechanics are unreal"
the middle is the drooling guy "umm actually mechanics arent everything shes just farming bots"
the top end is "her mechanics are unreal"
- not a generational talent tho that goes to primmie
i agree primmie very good
thenutoriousPRO [#15]ok this is just wrong lol
i dont think you realize how ass chinese t2 is lol
genuinely think na radiant ranked is harder
you're a crackhead I get it
thenutoriousPRO [#8]ppl were hyping up and glazing whzy for years when he was playing in china t2(so low skill level its crazy)
it is literally just sexism and transphobia
There is no tier 2 chinese league to begin with back then, that was pre frachsining before there's a clear divide between tier 1 and 2. 2023 then came along and Whyz beats NRG. SR1 failed in tier 2 iirc. Also one of the best GC team in G2 gozen got 13-0 by some random tier2 team.
Its literally just racism and Chinesephobia
heavensentsaint [#19]damn chinese t2 is so bad whzy shat on nrg twice!
because great players can play in bad leagues, i dont get how this is so hard to understand
not hating on whzy, both him and flor are insane players
just saying the way they are treated by the val community and specifically on vlr is very different and this is due to sexism and/or transphobia
LeCat [#22]There is no tier 2 chinese league to begin with back then, that was pre frachsining before there's a clear divide between tier 1 and 2. 2023 then came along and Whyz beats NRG. SR1 failed in tier 2 iirc. Also one of the best GC team in G2 gozen got 13-0 by some random tier2 team.
Its literally just racism and Chinesephobia
fearmongering abt non existent transphobia surrounding a players performance then being an obvious xenophobe is fucked! this guy is retarded
thenutoriousPRO [#18]flor will do the same
flor would put up PI numbers on Champs, what the fuck are you talking about
LeCat [#22]There is no tier 2 chinese league to begin with back then, that was pre frachsining before there's a clear divide between tier 1 and 2. 2023 then came along and Whyz beats NRG. SR1 failed in tier 2 iirc. Also one of the best GC team in G2 gozen got 13-0 by some random tier2 team.
Its literally just racism and Chinesephobia
look at whyz's old games
he was playing against teams none of us have heard of
i love chinese valorant, and love whyz, but dont act like he was farming superstars
thenutoriousPRO [#8]ppl were hyping up and glazing whzy for years when he was playing in china t2(so low skill level its crazy)
it is literally just sexism and transphobia
im just gonna say that whzy was a long time cs prodigy that everyone in the asian comp scene knew about lol so not the most accurate comparison
ppl were very high on him for many reasons not just the clips
DBStudios [#23]flore going 0/13/0 against mibr bro
Respectfully, mibr is ass flor could 100% drop at least 20 against them with ease.
DBStudios [#23]flore going 0/13/0 against mibr bro
this is what im talking about, this is just purely wrong
i cant wait for her to prove u wrong, just a matter of time
StutterSt3p [#30]Respectfully, mibr is ass flor could 100% drop at least 20 against them with ease.
😭😭 she got farmed in t2 what makes u think she can handle mibr rigglemaster
StutterSt3p [#30]Respectfully, mibr is ass flor could 100% drop at least 20 against them with ease.
20? no
12, maybe.
Shopify is going to lose 0-13 tho
heavensentsaint [#32]😭😭 she got farmed in t2 what makes u think she can handle mibr rigglemaster
When? Every time flor plays against a t2 team she's almost going positive while most of her teammates struggle. Besides a lot of t2 NA teams are better and have more mechanical skill than the mibr.
The full SR roster isn't even a top 5 premier team bro.
https://tracker.gg/valorant/premier/standings?region=NA_US_EAST&page=1
Ironically its the opposite of sexism or transphobia or whatever cuz they'd be legit randoms who nobody would talk about if it wasn't for gc.
thenutoriousPRO [#15]ok this is just wrong lol
i dont think you realize how ass chinese t2 is lol
genuinely think na radiant ranked is harder
now bros a racist. instead of being sexist and homophobic like those who dont like flor we being racist to whzy NRG's biggest fear.
ButterflyEffect23 [#33]20? no
12, maybe.
Shopify is going to lose 0-13 tho
Mibr might be the worst team in franchising. Maybe SR would still lose but you're crazy if you think flor is incapable of dropping 20 or more against them.
heavensentsaint [#32]😭😭 she got farmed in t2 what makes u think she can handle mibr rigglemaster
wtf are u even saying
she had a 1.30 rating in challengers qualifiers
dropped a very respectable 38 kills against winthrop university (one of the best na t2 teams)
Yuh_aye [#36]The full SR roster isn't even a top 5 premier team bro.
https://tracker.gg/valorant/premier/standings?region=NA_US_EAST&page=1Ironically its the opposite of sexism or transphobia or whatever cuz they'd be legit randoms who nobody would talk about if it wasn't for gc.
how is being on a bad team mean she is bad
no one said shopify is good
zhongZHI [#37]now bros a racist. instead of being sexist and homophobic like those who dont like flor we being racist to whzy NRG's biggest fear.
saying a league is ass is racist?? in that case u are sexist for saying gc is ass
StutterSt3p [#40]Mibr might be the worst team in franchising. Maybe SR would still lose but you're crazy if you think flor is incapable of dropping 20 or more against them.
ehhh, against MiBR? on a good day, maybe
against a real tier-1 team, probably PI
ButterflyEffect23 [#44]ehhh, against MiBR? on a good day, maybe
against a real tier-1 team, probably PI
It doesn't even have to be a good day imo, but sure. And tbh, even against good t1 teams I could still see her doing well. Like I said before, it depends on the situation, and SR is clearly not the best situation.
thenutoriousPRO [#43]saying a league is ass is racist?? in that case u are sexist for saying gc is ass
dawg are u braindead or what
Whzy was a known prodigy, he was playing CS a long time ago, Dank1ng was hyping him up for ages
Whzy was always a talent, and he was playing tier-2 because the franchised league in China didn't exist at the moment
Flor farms janitors in her tier-4 Mickey Mouse league and it's fine. Don't compare Whzy and chinese league to this farmer, it's disrespectful
ButterflyEffect23 [#44]ehhh, against MiBR? on a good day, maybe
against a real tier-1 team, probably PI
there is no way u would think icy could do well against t1 teams at the start of the year
she would do fine against any t1 team
thenutoriousPRO [#42]how is being on a bad team mean she is bad
no one said shopify is good
https://tracker.gg/valorant/match/e81c9498-78b7-45fc-8c7d-e16d2bf30752
Yeah but flor is getting diffed by randoms in these matches.
Unless you're telling me Cactus#3266 is also a franchising level talent.
thenutoriousPRO [#41]wtf are u even saying
she had a 1.30 rating in challengers qualifiers
dropped a very respectable 38 kills against winthrop university (one of the best na t2 teams)
https://www.vlr.gg/165110/nsic-vs-version1-challengers-league-north-america-uro32
bro this is a f/a team 😭😭
thenutoriousPRO [#47]there is no way u would think icy could do well against t1 teams at the start of the year
she would do fine against any t1 team
actually hilarious if you really think that
thenutoriousPRO [#43]saying a league is ass is racist?? in that case u are sexist for saying gc is ass
i using ur logic. no one has been saying shes shit its like how cn league is behind the 3 major ones rn. same thing with gc and no one blinks an eye. now ur whining just cuz everyone is saying she'd do badly. i mean she would if woudlnt she'd be signed. these orgs exist to make money not be sexist as hell lmfao.
ButterflyEffect23 [#46]dawg are u braindead or what
Whzy was a known prodigy, he was playing CS a long time ago, Dank1ng was hyping him up for ages
Whzy was always a talent, and he was playing tier-2 because the franchised league in China didn't exist at the moment
Flor farms janitors in her tier-4 Mickey Mouse league and it's fine. Don't compare Whzy and chinese league to this farmer, it's disrespectful
who tf is "Dank1ng" bro
many of the teams whzy was playing against would do shit in gc
idk what else to say to u, just think u are biased and deluded
heavensentsaint [#49]https://www.vlr.gg/165110/nsic-vs-version1-challengers-league-north-america-uro32
bro this is a f/a team 😭😭
Bro this is crazy you picked one of the few games the went negative in. Like cmon, she went positive against TTR and WU both in the challengers league rn.
thenutoriousPRO [#52]who tf is "Dank1ng" bro
many of the teams whzy was playing against would do shit in gc
idk what else to say to u, just think u are biased and deluded
Dank1ng is the legend of Chinese CS, you moron
he said that Whzy was next up
zhongZHI [#51]i using ur logic. no one has been saying shes shit its like how cn league is behind the 3 major ones rn. same thing with gc and no one blinks an eye. now ur whining just cuz everyone is saying she'd do badly. i mean she would if woudlnt she'd be signed. these orgs exist to make money not be sexist as hell lmfao.
u do know t1 pros literally didnt want to play with a gc player right
many vct players and orgs are sexist, that is the reality
StutterSt3p [#53]Bro this is crazy you picked one of the few games the went negative in. Like cmon, she went positive against TTR and WU both in the challengers league rn.
yeah bc that was a mickey mouse tourney
thenutoriousPRO [#52]who tf is "Dank1ng" bro
many of the teams whzy was playing against would do shit in gc
idk what else to say to u, just think u are biased and deluded
Dank1ng is a cs awper in china. decent fame.
ButterflyEffect23 [#54]Dank1ng is the legend of Chinese CS, you moron
he said that Whzy was next up
my bad for not knowing legendary chinese cs players when i never watched cs
also using that logic, sean gares (one of the best coaches of all time and na cs legend) hjas said flor is next up many time
heavensentsaint [#56]yeah bc that was a mickey mouse tourney
Winthrop they played in qualifiers and TTR was in a night's monthly, but idk see why that matters.
heavensentsaint [#49]https://www.vlr.gg/165110/nsic-vs-version1-challengers-league-north-america-uro32
bro this is a f/a team 😭😭
everyone has bad games bro
saying she got farmed when she had one of the highest ratings of any player is insane
thenutoriousPRO [#60]everyone has bad games bro
saying she got farmed when she had one of the highest ratings of any player is insane
these guys r literally 5 random dudes vs a franchised gc team bro how are you this delusional
Yuh_aye [#48]https://tracker.gg/valorant/match/e81c9498-78b7-45fc-8c7d-e16d2bf30752
Yeah but flor is getting diffed by randoms in these matches.
Unless you're telling me Cactus#3266 is also a franchising level talent.
theres no way we are talking about premier when flor has played well against t2 na pros...
heavensentsaint [#61]these guys r literally 5 random dudes vs a franchised gc team bro how are you this delusional
everyone has bad games dude
thenutoriousPRO [#55]u do know t1 pros literally didnt want to play with a gc player right
many vct players and orgs are sexist, that is the reality
i dont think orgs that are losing money really would care about sexism when they could sign a so called "god" tier player who could so called "save" their asses
dort [#38]"transphobia" for saying someone farming tier 5 bots wouldn't perform well in tier 1 😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹😹
She would perform well in tier 1 have you watched her play
zhongZHI [#65]i dont think orgs that are losing money really would care about sexism when they could sign a so called "god" tier player who could so called "save" their asses
esports are still sexist idk what to tell u
i can tell u guys dont really understand the reality of the lives women have to go through, especially lgbtq women
not even trying to hate the world is just an unfair place and i dont think u totally understand that
thenutoriousPRO [#25]because great players can play in bad leagues, i dont get how this is so hard to understand
not hating on whzy, both him and flor are insane players
just saying the way they are treated by the val community and specifically on vlr is very different and this is due to sexism and/or transphobia
Bro put whzy and flor in the same sentence I can’t 😭😭😭
Conceit [#68]You're right, it's just a combination of people glazing her more because she's in gc and people hating her more because she's in gc. Fuckers that hate on people are awful and reading this thread there's obviously some people that are just transphobic.
mfs be like "there is no transphobia" but a comment that says "he is a guy" has 5 upvotes
thenutoriousPRO [#62]theres no way we are talking about premier when flor has played well against t2 na pros...
Really? Can you please show me a match Flor has played against any team currently in challengers?
Maybe you have confused the quality of play in organized t2 valorant with Mr.Funhaver Invitationals, where some t2 pros may occasionally play on a pug team.
Cheasle2 [#66]She would perform well in tier 1 have you watched her play
I would play like tenz against bronze lobbies as well what are you on about 🤡
thenutoriousPRO [#67]esports are still sexist idk what to tell u
i can tell u guys dont really understand the reality of the lives women have to go through, especially lgbtq womennot even trying to hate the world is just an unfair place and i dont think u totally understand that
however sexist they maybe people look over nearly everything if they are losing money. this is a business in the end and if shes really that good why isnt the gc scene better. riot literally is providing more funding than any other game for this scene and it still sint growing
Yuh_aye [#71]Really? Can you please show me a match Flor has played against any team currently in challengers?
Maybe you have confused the quality of play in organized t2 valorant with Mr.Funhaver Invitationals, where some t2 pros may occasionally play on a pug team.
https://www.vlr.gg/281432/turtle-troop-vs-version1-knights-monthly-gauntlet-2023-october-sf
ButterflyEffect23 [#11]put any chinese player into GC and he's dropping 100 kills per bo3, lmao
Chinese tier 2 is terrible even some chinese TEAMS would lose in GC. I actually watch China nd GC
Yuh_aye [#71]Really? Can you please show me a match Flor has played against any team currently in challengers?
Maybe you have confused the quality of play in organized t2 valorant with Mr.Funhaver Invitationals, where some t2 pros may occasionally play on a pug team.
https://www.vlr.gg/281432/turtle-troop-vs-version1-knights-monthly-gauntlet-2023-october-sf
best team in na t2
https://www.vlr.gg/298243/winthrop-university-vs-shopify-rebellion-challengers-league-2024-north-america-qualifiers-oq-1
in actual t2 qualifiers if u think knights monthly isnt good enough
zhongZHI [#73]however sexist they maybe people look over nearly everything if they are losing money. this is a business in the end and if shes really that good why isnt the gc scene better. riot literally is providing more funding than any other game for this scene and it still sint growing
how is gc not growing her fault? u are just saying random things now
Tier 1 pros literally refused to play with GC players, i dont know how you cant see that as purely sexism
lemondou [#69]Bro put whzy and flor in the same sentence I can’t 😭😭😭
all these comments are gonna age so poorly
thenutoriousPRO [#63]everyone has bad games dude
this is the equivalent of sen losing to 5 diamond players
heavensentsaint [#79]this is the equivalent of sen losing to 5 diamond players
u keep saying game changers is t3
that team is t3
so its more like zekken playing poorly against another franchised team
https://www.vlr.gg/167368/sentinels-vs-fnatic-champions-tour-2023-lock-in-s-o-paulo-omega-ro16
also just realized that game was a year ago lmao
X20M2703 [#34]He is a Guy…..
is she like a trans from male to female or like a trans from female to male
t4 warrior either way 💀
thenutoriousPRO [#25]because great players can play in bad leagues, i dont get how this is so hard to understand
not hating on whzy, both him and flor are insane players
just saying the way they are treated by the val community and specifically on vlr is very different and this is due to sexism and/or transphobia
whzy is a real man
flor is just transformer who likes to farm at gc scene (riot don't even give a fk about gc)
that's a big diff
ayamgeprek1 [#82]whzy is a real man
flor is just transformer who likes to farm at gc scene (riot don't even give a fk about gc)that's a big diff
more transphobia ty for proving my point
thenutoriousPRO [#83]more transphobia ty for proving my point
there's only 2 gender exist, stop yapping about tr4nsph0b14
1phnxe [#81]is she like a trans from male to female or like a trans from female to male
t4 warrior either way 💀
Make to female 💀
thenutoriousPRO [#76]https://www.vlr.gg/281432/turtle-troop-vs-version1-knights-monthly-gauntlet-2023-october-sf
best team in na t2
https://www.vlr.gg/298243/winthrop-university-vs-shopify-rebellion-challengers-league-2024-north-america-qualifiers-oq-1
in actual t2 qualifiers if u think knights monthly isnt good enough
Ok so we have two examples.
1: Lets be real, its a knights monthly. They're not pulling out strats and playing with match intensity in a knights monthly.
2: This one is probably the one we should a more serious look at because both teams were likely giving it their all for these qualifiers.
In this match, Infiltrator (not exactly a star t2 duelist) gets the better of Flor, and every player except moobs (their initiator) has a better rating than Flor. Also Winthrop is at best a bottom 3 team. So if virtually every player on the bottom-of-the-barrel team is outperforming you.....
But one game isn't fair. Lets look at other games from (top 32) of those qualifiers and compare Flor to the opposing duelist.
vs Poppin (yes, the tiktoker)
Result: Flor does solidly better, with 0.07 better rating and ~20 more acs
vs Req (most famous for being a reyna instalocker in ranked, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Flor absolutely shits on Req. 1.43 vs 0.96 rating
G3 The Winthrop game from above
vs Infiltrator (a real t2 player, albeit on one of the worst t2 teams)
Result: Infiltrator does solidly better, with 0.06 better rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.
vs Car (someone who is not known at all, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Car absolutely shits on Flor. 1.43 vs 0.74 rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.
Next Qual
vs Req (yes, the same one) and Kaoticc (nobody, mr funhavers and knights blah blah you get the idea)
Result: Flor clears Kaoticc, but Req does slightly better, with a 0.05 better rating (and a smackdown on breeze)
vs Kehmicals (was a legit t2 pro in the early days of val, but very inactive since) and Mocking (the goat tbh)
Result: Flor clears Mocking, and does solidly better than Kehmicals, with 0.14 better rating and ~30 more acs.
TLDR: Flor's best performance as judged in Challengers open Qual games, where both teams are gonna be trying their best, is keeping up with Infiltrator, about as good as Poppin kept up with Flor. This doesn't scream 'generational talent/best mechanical player in the world ' being held back by sexism or something.
Yuh_aye [#86]Ok so we have two examples.
1: Lets be real, its a knights monthly. They're not pulling out strats and playing with match intensity in a knights monthly.
2: This one is probably the one we should a more serious look at because both teams were likely giving it their all for these qualifiers.
In this match, Infiltrator (not exactly a star t2 duelist) gets the better of Flor, and every player except moobs (their initiator) has a better rating than Flor. Also Winthrop is at best a bottom 3 team. So if virtually every player on the bottom-of-the-barrel team is outperforming you.....But one game isn't fair. Lets look at other games from (top 32) of those qualifiers and compare Flor to the opposing duelist.
vs Poppin (yes, the tiktoker)
Result: Flor does solidly better, with 0.07 better rating and ~20 more acsvs Req (most famous for being a reyna instalocker in ranked, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Flor absolutely shits on Req. 1.43 vs 0.96 ratingG3 The Winthrop game from above
vs Infiltrator (a real t2 player, albeit on one of the worst t2 teams)
Result: Infiltrator does solidly better, with 0.06 better rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.vs Car (someone who is not known at all, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Car absolutely shits on Flor. 1.43 vs 0.74 rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.Next Qual
vs Req (yes, the same one) and Kaoticc (nobody, mr funhavers and knights blah blah you get the idea)
Result: Flor clears Kaoticc, but Req does slightly better, with a 0.05 better rating (and a smackdown on breeze)vs Kehmicals (was a legit t2 pro in the early days of val, but very inactive since) and Mocking (the goat tbh)
Result: Flor clears Mocking, and does solidly better than Kehmicals, with 0.14 better rating and ~30 more acs.TLDR: Flor's best performance as judged in Challengers open Qual games, where both teams are gonna be trying their best, is keeping up with Infiltrator, about as good as Poppin kept up with Flor. This doesn't scream 'generational talent/best mechanical player in the world ' being held back by sexism or something.
No way you took the time to do this just to hate on someone. Touch grass holy shit.
Yuh_aye [#86]Ok so we have two examples.
1: Lets be real, its a knights monthly. They're not pulling out strats and playing with match intensity in a knights monthly.
2: This one is probably the one we should a more serious look at because both teams were likely giving it their all for these qualifiers.
In this match, Infiltrator (not exactly a star t2 duelist) gets the better of Flor, and every player except moobs (their initiator) has a better rating than Flor. Also Winthrop is at best a bottom 3 team. So if virtually every player on the bottom-of-the-barrel team is outperforming you.....But one game isn't fair. Lets look at other games from (top 32) of those qualifiers and compare Flor to the opposing duelist.
vs Poppin (yes, the tiktoker)
Result: Flor does solidly better, with 0.07 better rating and ~20 more acsvs Req (most famous for being a reyna instalocker in ranked, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Flor absolutely shits on Req. 1.43 vs 0.96 ratingG3 The Winthrop game from above
vs Infiltrator (a real t2 player, albeit on one of the worst t2 teams)
Result: Infiltrator does solidly better, with 0.06 better rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.vs Car (someone who is not known at all, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Car absolutely shits on Flor. 1.43 vs 0.74 rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.Next Qual
vs Req (yes, the same one) and Kaoticc (nobody, mr funhavers and knights blah blah you get the idea)
Result: Flor clears Kaoticc, but Req does slightly better, with a 0.05 better rating (and a smackdown on breeze)vs Kehmicals (was a legit t2 pro in the early days of val, but very inactive since) and Mocking (the goat tbh)
Result: Flor clears Mocking, and does solidly better than Kehmicals, with 0.14 better rating and ~30 more acs.TLDR: Flor's best performance as judged in Challengers open Qual games, where both teams are gonna be trying their best, is keeping up with Infiltrator, about as good as Poppin kept up with Flor. This doesn't scream 'generational talent/best mechanical player in the world ' being held back by sexism or something.
holy yap
ButterflyEffect23 [#14]she's playing against plumbers AND she's got destroyed by another GC team(G2) WITH A MAP ADVANTAGE
what generational talent are you talking about, stop bouncing on her nuts, my goodness
bro stop bouncing on her nuts had me dying XD
Yuh_aye [#86]Ok so we have two examples.
1: Lets be real, its a knights monthly. They're not pulling out strats and playing with match intensity in a knights monthly.
2: This one is probably the one we should a more serious look at because both teams were likely giving it their all for these qualifiers.
In this match, Infiltrator (not exactly a star t2 duelist) gets the better of Flor, and every player except moobs (their initiator) has a better rating than Flor. Also Winthrop is at best a bottom 3 team. So if virtually every player on the bottom-of-the-barrel team is outperforming you.....But one game isn't fair. Lets look at other games from (top 32) of those qualifiers and compare Flor to the opposing duelist.
vs Poppin (yes, the tiktoker)
Result: Flor does solidly better, with 0.07 better rating and ~20 more acsvs Req (most famous for being a reyna instalocker in ranked, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Flor absolutely shits on Req. 1.43 vs 0.96 ratingG3 The Winthrop game from above
vs Infiltrator (a real t2 player, albeit on one of the worst t2 teams)
Result: Infiltrator does solidly better, with 0.06 better rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.vs Car (someone who is not known at all, but has a bit of experience in t3 tournies, mostly mrfunhavers and knights monthlies.)
Result: Car absolutely shits on Flor. 1.43 vs 0.74 rating and a much better FK/FD ratio.Next Qual
vs Req (yes, the same one) and Kaoticc (nobody, mr funhavers and knights blah blah you get the idea)
Result: Flor clears Kaoticc, but Req does slightly better, with a 0.05 better rating (and a smackdown on breeze)vs Kehmicals (was a legit t2 pro in the early days of val, but very inactive since) and Mocking (the goat tbh)
Result: Flor clears Mocking, and does solidly better than Kehmicals, with 0.14 better rating and ~30 more acs.TLDR: Flor's best performance as judged in Challengers open Qual games, where both teams are gonna be trying their best, is keeping up with Infiltrator, about as good as Poppin kept up with Flor. This doesn't scream 'generational talent/best mechanical player in the world ' being held back by sexism or something.
lmao the moment u give a proper answer they say yapping
these guys just want to play victim and claim transphobia and live in an echo chamber
thenutoriousPRO [#88]holy yap
you could've read the tldr but people stupid enough to think flor is t1 probably can't read. Unlucky
lemondou [#72]I would play like tenz against bronze lobbies as well what are you on about 🤡
she plays well regardless of the lobby?
heavensentsaint [#90]lmao the moment u give a proper answer they say yapping
these guys just want to play victim and claim transphobia and live in an echo chamber
fine let me actually read this
Yuh_aye [#91]you could've read the tldr but people stupid enough to think flor is t1 probably can't read. Unlucky
i think the biggest thing u fail to recognize is that is very hard to frag highly or get a good rating when u lose a game, especially by a large measure. for example i think we can all agree zekken is a great player.
in this game against loud (https://www.vlr.gg/314645/sentinels-vs-loud-champions-tour-2024-americas-stage-1-w4) he got a significantly lower rating than qck. does this mean he is a worse player or even had a worse game? no. its a team game. if the team plays bad, generally the individual players will have bad stats. this is why i think looking at stats is kinda pointless and the only way to truly tell a players skill is to watch them play. again, flor could flop in t2, but using her stats when shes playing for a team that u guys call t3 or lower doesnt really prove if she is a t1 talent or not.
thenutoriousPRO [#94]i think the biggest thing u fail to recognize is that is very hard to frag highly or get a good rating when u lose a game, especially by a large measure. for example i think we can all agree zekken is a great player.
in this game against loud (https://www.vlr.gg/314645/sentinels-vs-loud-champions-tour-2024-americas-stage-1-w4) he got a significantly lower rating than qck. does this mean he is a worse player or even had a worse game? no. its a team game. if the team plays bad, generally the individual players will have bad stats. this is why i think looking at stats is kinda pointless and the only way to truly tell a players skill is to watch them play. again, flor could flop in t2, but using her stats when shes playing for a team that u guys call t3 or lower doesnt really prove if she is a t1 talent or not.
no wait this is different, qck was aspas for this game
Okay. I'll give you a take absolutely without considering the gender and the GC part from a person who has been supporting the Shopify rebellion.
Even in the games I've watched SR play, flor is really good cus opponent make too many mistakes, she is still very inconsistent on OP even in the games where she drops 40 kills cus she gets so many chances to get easy kills.
Also, her decision-making is not that good compared to a T1 player; she looks very good because she plays very flashy, but trust me, it's really easy to look good when ur opponents are just not shooting back.
She can play in a Tier1 VCT team, but she would be another average or below-average regular player at peak, nothing more than that.
Anti-fakenews [#98]Okay. I'll give you a take absolutely without considering the gender and the GC part from a person who has been supporting the Shopify rebellion.
Even in the games I've watched SR play, flor is really good cus opponent make too many mistakes, she is still very inconsistent on OP even in the games where she drops 40 kills cus she gets so many chances to get easy kills.
Also, her decision-making is not that good compared to a T1 player; she looks very good because she plays very flashy, but trust me, it's really easy to look good when ur opponents are just not shooting back.
She can play in a Tier1 VCT team, but she would be another average or below-average regular player at peak, nothing more than that.
not a bad take tbh
Anti-fakenews [#98]Okay. I'll give you a take absolutely without considering the gender and the GC part from a person who has been supporting the Shopify rebellion.
Even in the games I've watched SR play, flor is really good cus opponent make too many mistakes, she is still very inconsistent on OP even in the games where she drops 40 kills cus she gets so many chances to get easy kills.
Also, her decision-making is not that good compared to a T1 player; she looks very good because she plays very flashy, but trust me, it's really easy to look good when ur opponents are just not shooting back.
She can play in a Tier1 VCT team, but she would be another average or below-average regular player at peak, nothing more than that.
great take, I've been saying that if flor deserves to be in tier1 then she needs to play more like the tier1 duelists and be more consistent rather than doing too many flashy plays
Anti-fakenews [#98]Okay. I'll give you a take absolutely without considering the gender and the GC part from a person who has been supporting the Shopify rebellion.
Even in the games I've watched SR play, flor is really good cus opponent make too many mistakes, she is still very inconsistent on OP even in the games where she drops 40 kills cus she gets so many chances to get easy kills.
Also, her decision-making is not that good compared to a T1 player; she looks very good because she plays very flashy, but trust me, it's really easy to look good when ur opponents are just not shooting back.
She can play in a Tier1 VCT team, but she would be another average or below-average regular player at peak, nothing more than that.
I'll also be fair in admitting that her team is still holding her down way too hard; if she gets a good igl and good support, she can get even better, but she still needs to learn a lot.
thenutoriousPRO [#94]i think the biggest thing u fail to recognize is that is very hard to frag highly or get a good rating when u lose a game, especially by a large measure. for example i think we can all agree zekken is a great player.
in this game against loud (https://www.vlr.gg/314645/sentinels-vs-loud-champions-tour-2024-americas-stage-1-w4) he got a significantly lower rating than qck. does this mean he is a worse player or even had a worse game? no. its a team game. if the team plays bad, generally the individual players will have bad stats. this is why i think looking at stats is kinda pointless and the only way to truly tell a players skill is to watch them play. again, flor could flop in t2, but using her stats when shes playing for a team that u guys call t3 or lower doesnt really prove if she is a t1 talent or not.
in this game against loud he got a significantly lower rating than qck. does this mean he is a worse player or even had a worse game?
It does mean he had a worse game than qck, that's the whole point of the "rating". But Looking at a singular match doesn't tell an entire story, with more data, we can reduce that variability. Here's the full story of that split for zekken and qck, go find their names. I'll give you a hint, one will be at the top and the other will be at the bottom:
https://www.vlr.gg/event/stats/2004/champions-tour-2024-americas-stage-1
As for Flor, I went through every one of Flor's games in the top 32 of (both) Open Quals and compared the stats to the opposite duelist(s). If you have a serious methodological dispute with this, address that instead of just going with the whole "stats are bad" schtick, and regarding that...
why i think looking at stats is kinda pointless and the only way to truly tell a players skill is to watch them play
Far from pointless, stats are actually records of past events, that quantify them in an objective way. When we say "aspas has been playing out of his mind this split", the rating stat is a perfectly reasonable way to quantify this and allow us to discuss it in a comparative manner. No stat can ever tell an entire story, but saying stats are pointless and watching someone play is the best test of skill is braindead.
As for the whole "its a team game" point:
It's obviously a team game and nobody denies this, but there's no way to perfectly control every factor that can affect a performance. What we do know is that Flor's team is full of signed professionals who have built their careers on setting up Flor in gc. What we also know, is that with this team, Flor has not put up stats (ooh a super dirty word, I know) which would suggest a level of play that is good enough for Franchising, and is probably not even good enough for Challengers (4/5 players in that winthrop match were higher rated than Flor, ie: the smokes and senti players on the worst t2 team played better than Flor in that matchup)
thenutoriousPRO [#77]how is gc not growing her fault? u are just saying random things now
Tier 1 pros literally refused to play with GC players, i dont know how you cant see that as purely sexism
Never seen a successful mixed roster it'll probably never happen
glinki3436 [#106]''generational talent'' is insane. i can turn trans and go pro in womens vlr rn lmao
edit: im not gay so im not finna turn trans lil bros
then do it.
glinki3436 [#106]''generational talent'' is insane. i can turn trans and go pro in womens vlr rn lmao
edit: im not gay so im not finna turn trans lil bros
then do it
heavensentsaint [#90]lmao the moment u give a proper answer they say yapping
these guys just want to play victim and claim transphobia and live in an echo chamber
This is just nitpicking if we're being honest you could pick apart anyone's game like this, but no one is going to.
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