why they cs just dogshit but pretty good in val
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cn and kr cs
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No, it was the most popular FPS in Korea during 1.5 and 1.6, and has not much to do with SC or LoL. Same with China. The problem was competitions from Korean CS counterparts that were very popular in the 2000s and 2010s.
Conversely, there were several occasions when Korean teams had a deep run in several major 1.6 LANs and iirc winning 2 of today's Major equivalent LAN.
one of them was in 2024, provide a source for your playercount in china.
"9. Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
China covers over 7.54% of Counter-Strike: Global Offensive’s user base. While that may seem insignificant, it accounts for more than 110,000 players in this globally renowned game.
In 2023, CS:GO generated over $980 million in revenue, with a significant portion coming from microtransactions, such as selling in-game skins and cases. The Chinese market, known for its high engagement in virtual economies, has contributed meaningfully to this figure."
first of all, they are not going to be full chinese, because they love importing players, second of all even if this was true 110 000 is not an active playerbase, its the concurrent playerbase. for reference, csgo has an active playerbase of about 50 million, its concurrent peak is 1.8 million which is double valorant chinas concurrent peak of 1 million (https://www.coolest-gadgets.com/csgo-cs2-players-statistics/)
here another fun stat I found https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/1528w6r/hesketh2_valorant_player_numbers_in_china_were_so/
it means concurrent, but if you dont wanna believe that or the comments
heres some more stats that prove valorant china is big asf and bigger than csgo:
https://www.dexerto.com/valorant/vct-china-had-1-million-more-viewers-than-every-other-valorant-league-2870459/
https://valo2asia.com/valorant-is-now-5th-most-played-game-in-chinese-internet-cafes/ (very important link)
https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/1528w6r/hesketh2_valorant_player_numbers_in_china_were_so/
I know valorant playerbase is bigger, but saying CS2 is not popular there is just wrong because CS2 Shanghai major was able to generate nearly the same heat as Champions 2024 on Chinese streaming sites. Probably CS is popular casually while everyone just plays Valorant, regardless the gap between these two is not as big as you think. I was arguing more about your statement in #7 and the links you followed up with in #12.
okay I understand, but I mean then its just very hard to argue, do you know csgos actual chinese viewership and not just the heatscore?
because lets say the articles are wrong, how can you justify a 5x bigger presence in internet cafes if there is not a signifcant gap?
I cant call you wrong here, because I dont have enough information, so any justification is appreiciated
In fact, the problem is complicated, on the one hand, the Steam platform is not popular enough in China, and Valorant can use WeChat or QQ in China, just like Facebook and Twitter in foreign countries, which makes it much cheaper for players to get started.
Secondly, and I think the most important point, e-sports betting in China is illegal, but around 2018, CS gambling in China was very serious, so serious that almost all CS-related platforms in China were discussing betting; Players have also formed their own small groups within the group, which has led to the reluctance of some large capital clubs, such as EDG, to continue to do so.
Finally, I think the most important thing is that because of the impact of the epidemic, China finally lost the opportunity to learn and exchange with the leading EMEA, and there has been no good tactical coach to make up for the gap, neither Westmelon nor Jamyoong have been able to fill this vacancy, and the money that can be earned by playing with them in China is much higher than that of professional players, which also leads to some powerful young people choosing to play with them and giving up their careers.
In fact, the problem is complicated, and according to some gossip, JDG had planned to sell Stew, but no one wanted to buy Stew. Jamyoung has played with JDG players, and it is very likely that the original lineup of JDG2025 is viva Jamyoung JKUOR Ziyan sword9 However, due to the unfavorable training matches and some offseason games, JDG parachuted into the management and chose to remove sword9, and viva and JDG's original assistant coach chose to go out with sword9 to tyloo.
There are also some people who say that Jamyoung doesn't want to choose to play in T2 to gain experience, like Slowy
I don't know why I feel that you are as angry as I speak. While many Chinese players were happy that LVG and RA were able to release stickers on two majro, the Chinese community would rather see a team like the 2018 Super Tyloo. Especially in the Chinese community, they are full of arrogance about Valorant, and they hope that there will be a team that can compete with EDG
sry bad English
i think In reality, even in China's C+ tier servers (similar to Faceit levels 3-4), players do occasionally use basic utility combos or execute strategies. The core issue lies in Chinese players' tendency to rigidly stick to the same three maps. They become completely lost when facing unfamiliar maps. Additionally, rampant cheaters in higher ranks have driven some players to adopt a lone-wolf playstyle focused solely on individual heroics. I believe this mentality has negatively impacted the development of current Chinese Counter-Strike professional players.
In reality, Chinese VALORANT teams like TEC, JDG, and AG also exhibit this "individual heroism" mentality. While Chinese players deeply admire mechanically gifted stars like donk, they do attempt to prioritize utility usage and coordinated plays. However, when the game tilts against them or players become tilted (mentally frustrated), they often regress to reckless dry peeks, forced solo plays, or even selfish/toxic behaviors that hurt team cohesion.
Regarding South Korea, I'm not entirely clear on the situation. In fact, CrossFire (the game) never maintained prolonged popularity in China due to Tencent's internal issues with employees selling cheats, which catastrophically destroyed the game's ecosystem. This even spawned viral memes like "Big Brother's Theme Song" (a musical track ironically used to mock players using outrageous hacks).【【穿越火线16周年纯享版】秦朝老兵专用BGM！】 https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV13E421A7Lj/?share_source=copy_web&vd_source=e0ab7143a26a17e3fd019c4e827c7607
Indeed, the Tencent employee involved in internal cheat distribution was ultimately prosecuted by the company itself through legal channels, with the perpetrator receiving prison time. This incident became a landmark case demonstrating Tencent's zero-tolerance policy towards game integrity violations, while also serving as a deterrent within China's gaming industry ecosystem.
Interestingly, while you can still find people playing CS:GO in Chinese internet cafes today, most players (myself included) avoid it primarily due to security fears - there's widespread paranoia about Steam accounts being hacked and inventories being wiped clean.
cause in valorant, riot gave Asian teams equal international slots -> give equal opportunity for growth and improvement.
CS very neglectful in Asia market, only care to western audience so more western teams = less improvement for Asia CS teams to get better.
International experience is huge to improvement of the team, just look at 2021 Masters Berlin PRX.
most popular fps game in korea 2001~2003 was CS (maybe u can argue with R6) but
1.6 was not played any PC Cafes because of some legal issues
2004~2005 was total chaos by korean local online games (Special Force, Karma, ETC) cuz its f2p,
and the game called Sudden Attack dominated from 2006 and that bs ruined the korean fps scene
that's why CS has been gradually forgotten since 2009, and no one even care.
val is more of a tactical game, while cs is more mechanical
you can argue that asians tend to be smarter than eu/na/br, and that eu/na/br are waaaaaay better in mechanics
imo that takes a big part on it, but there is also external issues like koreans are addicted to mobas, china used to ban western fps games until not long ago and stuff like that
im pretty sure you have some western-stereotype for asians
most of asians play tactical FPS but unfortunately is not CS, this is the main point.
have u even seen chinese top crossfire team playing each other or korean top sudden attack team?
i can tell you theres an chinese s1mple, korean zywoo on these scene
that's exactly my point.
crossfire is 90% chinese and 10% brazilians - there is no other decent nationality there
westerns are better at mechanical games - even in val, western players are better than asians in mechanics (that includes aim), but cs2 is a heavily dependant mechanical game, while val is not (it's mostly tactical with skills)
there is no s1mples in china playing crossfire, because they play crossfire, not cs2, it's the same logic, if western played crossfire they would probably be better at mechanics (you can notice this on crossfire - brazilians have very good aim, while chinese are good in it but not like the brazilians, then they win by using their brains)
In reality, China has produced numerous FPS talents with exceptional mechanical skills, though their brilliance often gets overshadowed in CS:GO . Take CrossFire legend doo for example - his sniper prowess in the game's notoriously clunky 8-tick servers reached mythical proportions, with flick shots defying the technical limitations.
【CF比赛名场面，AG狙击手Doo烟雾里四杀！科技般的操作，惊艳全场。全员大喊卧槽!】 https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1PY411k7po/?share_source=copy_web&vd_source=e0ab7143a26a17e3fd019c4e827c7607
【CF比赛名场面，Doo瞄右边把左边打了。鼠标里好像有器灵，跟开了挂一样太吓人了】 https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1Yx4y1J7C4/?share_source=copy_web&vd_source=e0ab7143a26a17e3fd019c4e827c7607
Another case is Lsn from AG esports, a former CrossFire champion who has also climbed to the upper echelons of Chinese CS:GO 's ranked ladder (equivalent to Global Elite). This reality highlights China's fragmented FPS ecosystem, where world-class talents remain siloed within domestic gaming ecosystems due to market segmentation and differing competitive landscapes.
The Chinese government's crackdown on violent video games traces back to 2008 policy changes, triggered by a horrific 2002 incident where two teenagers barred from entering internet cafes set fire to a gaming venue, killing 24 people. This tragedy solidified mainstream Chinese perceptions of internet addiction as a psychiatric disorder (officially recognized as "internet addiction disorder" from 2008-2019) and framed online gaming as a social ill comparable to drug abuse. It wasn't until 2011 that China implemented its game license approval system, requiring all titles to undergo government censorship reviews while imposing mandatory playtime restrictions for minors under 18.
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