why they cs just dogshit but pretty good in val
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cn and kr cs
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DrudaL [#5]CS just bad at reaching asia market
but cs seems pretty popular in china even with no real Chinese representation
GambleNats [#7]CS is not popular in china or korea. for china alone Valorant had like 1 million peak concurrent players while cs has like 100K active playerbase
thats just not true for china lol
Yistyy [#8]i think they just entered the scene too late.
no china and korea were way bigger in cs 1.6 but they never regained it in csgo
aaaa420 [#10]no china and korea were way bigger in cs 1.6 but they never regained it in csgo
You're right, I have no idea what I'm talking about.
GambleNats [#12]
those articles are talking about the playercount in 2019, cs had about 500k active players in general lol
aaaa420 [#14]those articles are talking about the playercount in 2019, cs had about 500k active players in general lol
one of them was in 2024, provide a source for your playercount in china.
"9. Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
China covers over 7.54% of Counter-Strike: Global Offensive’s user base. While that may seem insignificant, it accounts for more than 110,000 players in this globally renowned game.
In 2023, CS:GO generated over $980 million in revenue, with a significant portion coming from microtransactions, such as selling in-game skins and cases. The Chinese market, known for its high engagement in virtual economies, has contributed meaningfully to this figure."
aaaa420 [#14]those articles are talking about the playercount in 2019, cs had about 500k active players in general lol
He's also comparing Valorant's daily player count with CS concurrent player count lol
GambleNats [#15]one of them was in 2024, provide a source for your playercount in china.
"9. Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
China covers over 7.54% of Counter-Strike: Global Offensive’s user base. While that may seem insignificant, it accounts for more than 110,000 players in this globally renowned game.In 2023, CS:GO generated over $980 million in revenue, with a significant portion coming from microtransactions, such as selling in-game skins and cases. The Chinese market, known for its high engagement in virtual economies, has contributed meaningfully to this figure."
The 110,000 number is concurrent player count, the number of players playing at a certain instant. Daily player count is obviously going to be more
i_hate_winning [#16]He's also comparing Valorant's daily player count with CS concurrent player count lol
its the valorant concurrent player count, just check the poster yourself, or read the comments on the reddit page
GambleNats [#15]one of them was in 2024, provide a source for your playercount in china.
"9. Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
China covers over 7.54% of Counter-Strike: Global Offensive’s user base. While that may seem insignificant, it accounts for more than 110,000 players in this globally renowned game.In 2023, CS:GO generated over $980 million in revenue, with a significant portion coming from microtransactions, such as selling in-game skins and cases. The Chinese market, known for its high engagement in virtual economies, has contributed meaningfully to this figure."
i would like to see this sites source for the current playercount too cause i cant even find any way to check it by region
i_hate_winning [#17]The 110,000 number is concurrent player count, the number of players playing at a certain instant. Daily player count is obviously going to be more
refer back to #18
GambleNats [#18]its the valorant concurrent player count, just check the poster yourself, or read the comments on the reddit page
Don't know about comments, but the text in the image translates to "Fearless Contract, the highest single-day online number in the national server, stably exceeding 1 million". I don't know if single-day online number would be daily player count or concurrent.
GambleNats [#22]refer back to #18
btw there was 8643 teams in the shanghai major open qualifier for china which would make up for 42k players alone,are u telling me that almost half of the chinese active playerbase played that lol
In fact, the problem is complicated, on the one hand, the Steam platform is not popular enough in China, and Valorant can use WeChat or QQ in China, just like Facebook and Twitter in foreign countries, which makes it much cheaper for players to get started.
Secondly, and I think the most important point, e-sports betting in China is illegal, but around 2018, CS gambling in China was very serious, so serious that almost all CS-related platforms in China were discussing betting; Players have also formed their own small groups within the group, which has led to the reluctance of some large capital clubs, such as EDG, to continue to do so.
Finally, I think the most important thing is that because of the impact of the epidemic, China finally lost the opportunity to learn and exchange with the leading EMEA, and there has been no good tactical coach to make up for the gap, neither Westmelon nor Jamyoong have been able to fill this vacancy, and the money that can be earned by playing with them in China is much higher than that of professional players, which also leads to some powerful young people choosing to play with them and giving up their careers.
Yistyy [#8]i think they just entered the scene too late.
This is also one of the reasons, CSGO was born in 2012, but it was only launched in China in 20155
aaaa420 [#25]btw there was 8643 teams in the shanghai major open qualifier for china which would make up for 42k players alone,are u telling me that almost half of the chinese active playerbase played that lol
first of all, they are not going to be full chinese, because they love importing players, second of all even if this was true 110 000 is not an active playerbase, its the concurrent playerbase. for reference, csgo has an active playerbase of about 50 million, its concurrent peak is 1.8 million which is double valorant chinas concurrent peak of 1 million (https://www.coolest-gadgets.com/csgo-cs2-players-statistics/)
XYLITOL_WU [#26]In fact, the problem is complicated, on the one hand, the Steam platform is not popular enough in China, and Valorant can use WeChat or QQ in China, just like Facebook and Twitter in foreign countries, which makes it much cheaper for players to get started.
Secondly, and I think the most important point, e-sports betting in China is illegal, but around 2018, CS gambling in China was very serious, so serious that almost all CS-related platforms in China were discussing betting; Players have also formed their own small groups within the group, which has led to the reluctance of some large capital clubs, such as EDG, to continue to do so.
Finally, I think the most important thing is that because of the impact of the epidemic, China finally lost the opportunity to learn and exchange with the leading EMEA, and there has been no good tactical coach to make up for the gap, neither Westmelon nor Jamyoong have been able to fill this vacancy, and the money that can be earned by playing with them in China is much higher than that of professional players, which also leads to some powerful young people choosing to play with them and giving up their careers.
its really sad to see how far china cs has fallen from the days of tyloo and xccurate. at least mongolz are carrying the burden and expectations of asian cs on their backs
aaaa420 [#21]i would like to see this sites source for the current playercount too cause i cant even find any way to check it by region
I would assume you can check it on the chinese steam client, but I have no way of confirming or denying, because I too can only use google to search of this information, and no other sites state this unless its older such as the reddit post there
GambleNats [#28]first of all, they are not going to be full chinese, because they love importing players, second of all even if this was true 110 000 is not an active playerbase, its the concurrent playerbase. for reference, csgo has an active playerbase of about 50 million, its concurrent peak is 1.8 million which is double valorant chinas concurrent peak of 1 million (https://www.coolest-gadgets.com/csgo-cs2-players-statistics/)
bro its a open qualifier like 95% of the teams are not even real orgs who import anyone its just 5 stacks mostly theres no way even 10% of that is imports lol,and still if u have 42k players who care enough to play a major qualifier theres no way only 100k players play on average lol
aaaa420 [#21]i would like to see this sites source for the current playercount too cause i cant even find any way to check it by region
here another fun stat I found https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/1528w6r/hesketh2_valorant_player_numbers_in_china_were_so/
i_hate_winning [#23]Don't know about comments, but the text in the image translates to "Fearless Contract, the highest single-day online number in the national server, stably exceeding 1 million". I don't know if single-day online number would be daily player count or concurrent.
it means concurrent, but if you dont wanna believe that or the comments
heres some more stats that prove valorant china is big asf and bigger than csgo:
https://www.dexerto.com/valorant/vct-china-had-1-million-more-viewers-than-every-other-valorant-league-2870459/
https://valo2asia.com/valorant-is-now-5th-most-played-game-in-chinese-internet-cafes/ (very important link)
https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/1528w6r/hesketh2_valorant_player_numbers_in_china_were_so/
aaaa420 [#31]bro its a open qualifier like 95% of the teams are not even real orgs who import anyone its just 5 stacks mostly theres no way even 10% of that is imports lol,and still if u have 42k players who care enough to play a major qualifier theres no way only 100k players play on average lol
again, its not 100K players on average, its concurrent
GambleNats [#32]here another fun stat I found https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/1528w6r/hesketh2_valorant_player_numbers_in_china_were_so/
a fun stat a couple days from when valorant was officially released in china lol
aaaa420 [#31]bro its a open qualifier like 95% of the teams are not even real orgs who import anyone its just 5 stacks mostly theres no way even 10% of that is imports lol,and still if u have 42k players who care enough to play a major qualifier theres no way only 100k players play on average lol
https://valo2asia.com/valorant-is-now-5th-most-played-game-in-chinese-internet-cafes/ valorant also has 5x the playerbase of csgo in internet cafes just for another reference
GambleNats [#34]again, its not 100K players on average, its concurrent
yea and ur telling me 42k chinese people are interested enough to know theres a shanghai major open qualifier going and find a team and play it
aaaa420 [#35]a fun stat a couple days from when valorant was officially released in china lol
? then provide me something more accurate
aaaa420 [#37]yea and ur telling me 42k chinese people are interested enough to know theres a shanghai major open qualifier going and find a team and play it
csgo is still the tenth most popular online game in china and if theres an open qualifer to an event in their country, yes it makes sense they would be interested
GambleNats [#38]? then provide me something more accurate
u havent provided any source for the current playerbase of cs lol,u showed that a couple months from valorants release it was played more than cs in internet cafes
GambleNats [#33]it means concurrent, but if you dont wanna believe that or the comments
heres some more stats that prove valorant china is big asf and bigger than csgo:
https://www.dexerto.com/valorant/vct-china-had-1-million-more-viewers-than-every-other-valorant-league-2870459/
https://valo2asia.com/valorant-is-now-5th-most-played-game-in-chinese-internet-cafes/ (very important link)
https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/comments/1528w6r/hesketh2_valorant_player_numbers_in_china_were_so/
I know valorant playerbase is bigger, but saying CS2 is not popular there is just wrong because CS2 Shanghai major was able to generate nearly the same heat as Champions 2024 on Chinese streaming sites. Probably CS is popular casually while everyone just plays Valorant, regardless the gap between these two is not as big as you think. I was arguing more about your statement in #7 and the links you followed up with in #12.
aaaa420 [#40]u havent provided any source for the current playerbase of cs lol,u showed that a couple months from valorants release it was played more than cs in internet cafes
yeah, i did the concurrent one because thats the only ones we have access too, if you wanna call them wrong, be my guest, but you havent provided anything to do so. I provided those other links as they help build my case that valorant in general is more popular than cs.
I will happily be wrong if you can provide solid evidence
GambleNats [#42]yeah, i did the concurrent one because thats the only ones we have access too, if you wanna call them wrong, be my guest, but you havent provided anything to do so. I provided those other links as they help build my case that valorant in general is more popular than cs.
I will happily be wrong if you can provide solid evidence
the only concurrent info u can find is from 5 years ago thats the problem
aaaa420 [#43]the only concurrent info u can find is from 5 years ago thats the problem
I gave you a more recent article, and u chose not to believe it. but you want me to believe you because?
GambleNats [#44]I gave you a more recent article, and u chose not to believe it. but you want me to believe you because?
the article literally doesnt include valorant in the top 10 most player games lol
i_hate_winning [#41]I know valorant playerbase is bigger, but saying CS2 is not popular there is just wrong because CS2 Shanghai major was able to generate nearly the same heat as Champions 2024 on Chinese streaming sites. Probably CS is popular casually while everyone just plays Valorant, regardless the gap between these two is not as big as you think. I was arguing more about your statement in #7 and the links you followed up with in #12.
okay I understand, but I mean then its just very hard to argue, do you know csgos actual chinese viewership and not just the heatscore?
because lets say the articles are wrong, how can you justify a 5x bigger presence in internet cafes if there is not a signifcant gap?
I cant call you wrong here, because I dont have enough information, so any justification is appreiciated
aaaa420 [#45]the article literally doesnt include valorant in the top 10 most player games lol
chinese valorant in early 2024 wasnt that high (reminder valorant released in late 2023) it peaked much later after masters shanghai.
goofyahh1447 [#2]it's just that EMEA valo is dogshit in comparision to EMEA cs so it makes other regions look good
emea has the most trophies out of any region in 4 years of valorant esports though lol
aaaa420 [#6]but cs seems pretty popular in china even with no real Chinese representation
respect lynn vision and rare atom at least a little please
those teams mean something to me man
Camille [#24]no way cs didnt reach china but reached mongolia
china fell off after covid and mongolia rose to top during covid
very simple
XYLITOL_WU [#26]In fact, the problem is complicated, on the one hand, the Steam platform is not popular enough in China, and Valorant can use WeChat or QQ in China, just like Facebook and Twitter in foreign countries, which makes it much cheaper for players to get started.
Secondly, and I think the most important point, e-sports betting in China is illegal, but around 2018, CS gambling in China was very serious, so serious that almost all CS-related platforms in China were discussing betting; Players have also formed their own small groups within the group, which has led to the reluctance of some large capital clubs, such as EDG, to continue to do so.
Finally, I think the most important thing is that because of the impact of the epidemic, China finally lost the opportunity to learn and exchange with the leading EMEA, and there has been no good tactical coach to make up for the gap, neither Westmelon nor Jamyoong have been able to fill this vacancy, and the money that can be earned by playing with them in China is much higher than that of professional players, which also leads to some powerful young people choosing to play with them and giving up their careers.
how could this powerhouse of a player "jamyoung" fail for valorant trials and return to that dogshit game?
GambleNats [#47]chinese valorant in early 2024 wasnt that high (reminder valorant released in late 2023) it peaked much later after masters shanghai.
so when valorant released in late 2023 in those posts u linked it was soaring past cs in popularity but in a couple months it was not even in the top 10 while cs was? And it sky rocketed after a chinese tournament but u think the shanghai major didnt increase cs player count lol
Cryptic88 [#29]its really sad to see how far china cs has fallen from the days of tyloo and xccurate. at least mongolz are carrying the burden and expectations of asian cs on their backs
funny how mongolz achieved far better results in less than 3 years than china did in a decade and a half kekw
GambleNats [#7]CS is not popular in china or korea. for china alone Valorant had like 1 million peak concurrent players while cs has like 100K active playerbase
cs could be popular again if chinese teams start putting up better results in international tournaments i think
Anzaldinho [#55]cs could be popular again if chinese teams start putting up better results in international tournaments i think
yes, the more representation of china, the more attraction, a lot of the csgo playerbase is uncs
aaaa420 [#52]so when valorant released in late 2023 in those posts u linked it was soaring past cs in popularity but in a couple months it was not even in the top 10 while cs was? And it sky rocketed after a chinese tournament but u think the shanghai major didnt increase cs player count lol
well the chinese team are actually good in valorant bringing in viewership and players.
with reference to this
so when valorant released in late 2023 in those posts u linked it was soaring past cs in popularity but in a couple months it was not even in the top 10 while cs was?
Money, this article talks about player count but its mainly about the chinese video game market sales. valorant simply just didnt have the oppurtunity for that yet being released so early, with such limited data
GambleNats [#57]well the chinese team are actually good in valorant bringing in viewership and players.
with reference to this
so when valorant released in late 2023 in those posts u linked it was soaring past cs in popularity but in a couple months it was not even in the top 10 while cs was?
Money, this article talks about player count but its mainly about the chinese video game market sales. valorant simply just didnt have the oppurtunity for that yet being released so early, with such limited data
china already had edg in 2023 and even the blg upsets in champs china was already seen as a good and improving in early 2024,and nothing was really different until champs 2024
aaaa420 [#58]china already had edg in 2023 and even the blg upsets in champs china was already seen as a good and improving in early 2024,and nothing was really different until champs 2024
you dont understand the hype of FPX in shanghai it was covered in forums of praise of their performance, anyways im done with this thread, its way too long and its like 1 hours worth of my time, I do not need it to take more. have a good day or night
GambleNats [#59]you dont understand the hype of FPX in shanghai it was covered in forums of praise of their performance, anyways im done with this thread, its way too long and its like 1 hours worth of my time, I do not need it to take more. have a good day or night
and ur telling me blg upsetting nrg twice in 2023 wasnt lol? Or edg starting to beat good teams already in 2023 lol,i dont think that makes any sense,
just went and checked and blg vs nrg match has almost a million wiews on bilibili while fpx shanghai is in about 200-300k i dont think it was anymore hype or made any difference lol but yea
Cryptic88 [#29]its really sad to see how far china cs has fallen from the days of tyloo and xccurate. at least mongolz are carrying the burden and expectations of asian cs on their backs
i also miss tyloo bro
Anzaldinho [#51]how could this powerhouse of a player "jamyoung" fail for valorant trials and return to that dogshit game?
In fact, the problem is complicated, and according to some gossip, JDG had planned to sell Stew, but no one wanted to buy Stew. Jamyoung has played with JDG players, and it is very likely that the original lineup of JDG2025 is viva Jamyoung JKUOR Ziyan sword9 However, due to the unfavorable training matches and some offseason games, JDG parachuted into the management and chose to remove sword9, and viva and JDG's original assistant coach chose to go out with sword9 to tyloo.
There are also some people who say that Jamyoung doesn't want to choose to play in T2 to gain experience, like Slowy
Anzaldinho [#54]imagine how atrociously asscheeks southeast asian counter-strike was if you consider korean and chinese counter strike teams always beating southeast asian and mongolian teams in qualifiers and you consider them bad
I don't know why I feel that you are as angry as I speak. While many Chinese players were happy that LVG and RA were able to release stickers on two majro, the Chinese community would rather see a team like the 2018 Super Tyloo. Especially in the Chinese community, they are full of arrogance about Valorant, and they hope that there will be a team that can compete with EDG
tserc [#4]CS wasn't really that popular in KR, since it coincided with the release of LoL and the popularity of StarCraft during that time iirc (anyone pls cmiiw)
As for CN, it's more of a casual rather than a competitive fanbase (again, pls cmiiw)
No, it was the most popular FPS in Korea during 1.5 and 1.6, and has not much to do with SC or LoL. Same with China. The problem was competitions from Korean CS counterparts that were very popular in the 2000s and 2010s.
Conversely, there were several occasions when Korean teams had a deep run in several major 1.6 LANs and iirc winning 2 of today's Major equivalent LAN.
XYLITOL_WU [#63]I don't know why I feel that you are as angry as I speak. While many Chinese players were happy that LVG and RA were able to release stickers on two majro, the Chinese community would rather see a team like the 2018 Super Tyloo. Especially in the Chinese community, they are full of arrogance about Valorant, and they hope that there will be a team that can compete with EDG
from watching some chinese perspective on their cs scene and translating some opinions from chinese cs fans,it seems the biggest problem is that chinese cs players in pugs care mostly about just being insane mechanically but not on fundamentals or playing the game right?
Anzaldinho [#49]respect lynn vision and rare atom at least a little please
those teams mean something to me man
Even b4 them tyloo always showed up at majors prepared to humble pple on inferrno... they were decent with bntet xccurate (bntet was calling and fragging while comming in english mandarin and indonesian
aaaa420 [#65]from watching some chinese perspective on their cs scene and translating some opinions from chinese cs fans,it seems the biggest problem is that chinese cs players in pugs care mostly about just being insane mechanically but not on fundamentals or playing the game right?
sry bad English
i think In reality, even in China's C+ tier servers (similar to Faceit levels 3-4), players do occasionally use basic utility combos or execute strategies. The core issue lies in Chinese players' tendency to rigidly stick to the same three maps. They become completely lost when facing unfamiliar maps. Additionally, rampant cheaters in higher ranks have driven some players to adopt a lone-wolf playstyle focused solely on individual heroics. I believe this mentality has negatively impacted the development of current Chinese Counter-Strike professional players.
Anzaldinho [#48]emea has the most trophies out of any region in 4 years of valorant esports though lol
Americas: 3 Masters, 2 Champs.
EMEA: 3 Masters 1 Champs.
aaaa420 [#65]from watching some chinese perspective on their cs scene and translating some opinions from chinese cs fans,it seems the biggest problem is that chinese cs players in pugs care mostly about just being insane mechanically but not on fundamentals or playing the game right?
In reality, Chinese VALORANT teams like TEC, JDG, and AG also exhibit this "individual heroism" mentality. While Chinese players deeply admire mechanically gifted stars like donk, they do attempt to prioritize utility usage and coordinated plays. However, when the game tilts against them or players become tilted (mentally frustrated), they often regress to reckless dry peeks, forced solo plays, or even selfish/toxic behaviors that hurt team cohesion.
ButterflyEffect23 [#3]Korean CS died when MVP.PK went to Valorant and became the Vision Strikers
Chinese CS just lacks good local IGLs and there's not a lot of young upcoming talents
I miss 2018 Tyloo
XYLITOL_WU [#69]In reality, Chinese VALORANT teams like TEC, JDG, and AG also exhibit this "individual heroism" mentality. While Chinese players deeply admire mechanically gifted stars like donk, they do attempt to prioritize utility usage and coordinated plays. However, when the game tilts against them or players become tilted (mentally frustrated), they often regress to reckless dry peeks, forced solo plays, or even selfish/toxic behaviors that hurt team cohesion.
ohh ok thanks for clarifying ur english is really good btw no need to apologize lol,well atleast i see some positives for the future like kennys partnering with some wealthy chinese business man to develop the chinese local scene
i_hate_winning [#20]I am not sure about China but Korea won a major in CS 1.6.
Iirc It wasn't a major but an S-tier tournament i
ButterflyEffect23 [#3]Korean CS died when MVP.PK went to Valorant and became the Vision Strikers
Chinese CS just lacks good local IGLs and there's not a lot of young upcoming talents
lynn vision
XYLITOL_WU [#63]I don't know why I feel that you are as angry as I speak. While many Chinese players were happy that LVG and RA were able to release stickers on two majro, the Chinese community would rather see a team like the 2018 Super Tyloo. Especially in the Chinese community, they are full of arrogance about Valorant, and they hope that there will be a team that can compete with EDG
i am not angry with cncs bro i support cncs and krcs
original poster said cncs and krcs are bad so i thought sea cs must have been very bad because in asia qualifiers cncs always beat other asian teams
ergerg [#78]one word: Crossfire
I never seen anybody play CSGO in the last 15 years in Asia, even kids at internet cafes
which country
mongolian kids been playing 1.6 and GO in internet cafes for decades now and we still do
Azzelastia [#68]Americas: 3 Masters, 2 Champs.
EMEA: 3 Masters 1 Champs.
never forget how NA was calling loud win a fluke but as soon as franchise started you guys sharing trophies xDD
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