EU has 2 teams in top 4
NA has just 1..maybe its gonna be sentinels diff but EU teams better than other NA teams
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why EU>NA
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where does this "destroy" comes from. fnc with sen was close... also... we can just pull the seeding argument. liquid would have been destroyed by sen, and v1 would have lost to fnatic, like they just did anyway, which would have made both regions have a a team in lower bracket... why didn't that happen? because liquid won challenger finals in emea with a 3:2 against fnatic... based on performance alone, overall, Liquid wouldn't stand a chance against Sen, but fnatic already played them and the games were close.
ok so for you 2:1 is close and 2:0 isn't. noted.... it was a 13:11 and a 13:10... i mean ok... your logic is that if you win 2:0 by 13:11 or overtime is the same as winning 13:4 and 13:5... i swear only arguments that suit your arguments. Yes, it was close matches, unlike Sen vs Nuturn that was also 2:0 but in that case, it was a stomp.
Yeah. I bet, at one important event, when you go in 13-11 and 13-10 you troll and throw, but when you win 13-4 and 13-5, respectively 13-6 and 13-7 you try your best. I swear you guys would find any excuse to defend this team... Let me guess... they played with blindfolded and with hands tied when they got stomped by BBG. I start to see a pattern here with people that got tsm flairs...
No one ever said 13-6 and 13-7 was "trying your best." Certain games you can tell whether not it was close just based on the gun play and general stuff like that. Sen vs FNC was a strategical outplay in most cases and didn't look like Sentinels gave it their all. A lot of rounds within that match up were given up by Sentinels such as Icebox. They were 5 rounds up and then threw 4 rounds in a row after that just with misplacement of economy and getting cocky with plays. Same thing happened on haven with their clear advantage after half and winning both pistol rounds.
Any 13-4 game is a massive strategical outplay and is in no way "trying your best." If anything, "being in the zone" would be the more accurate term since they were just "feeling it that day" and outplayed their opponents badly.
Sentinels so far looked far too dominant within the scene. My TSM flair has nothing to do with this particular analysis, since it's just the team I've supported since beta so your ad hominem is just irresponsible.
T1 was the one to go toe-to-toe against them definitely, but that was only once. Maybe 100T(they could've 2-0'd, but choked), but Bind was dominant for SEN and for C9B I don't think that was very close overall, considering SEN 3-0'd C9B before that and during a time where there was a meta-transition.
I mean NA is 100% a strong region, possibly stronger than EU and maybe EMEA and I agree, that we should wait until the tournament is over. Also we should wait a little bit after the tournament to see how the continuations are in their own regions. Maybe Liquid just fall apart and get exposed, maybe that happens to V1 too, we'll see.
I agree that we should wait for tomorrow. I feel like people are rushing to give hot takes. Oh yea that ABX and T1 game that Sentinels lost and almost lost. ABX are really good. They'll still be really good. But Sentinels are a slow starter for some reason so they kinda just flopped in the early parts. And T1 abused the shit out of the meta. I think T1 and ABX will be very strong teams. But I think the current Sen will be much better than them. But as you said. We should wait to see what happens tomorrow and what happens at Masters Berlin and the time inbetween.
Jammyz is still carrying his load with his frags and his util. I feel like people are underestimating how well Jammyz is doing. I feel bad for wippie that he couldn't get a visa. But this proved that Jammyz is a top level player. It's not as much of a difference as people expect, although v1 would have done better with Wippie probably. (Jammyz usually had a very high acs during the tourney, right? at least he seemed to play almost up to par in Wippies place). I think V1 would've looked much better with Wippie but I still think they would get eliminated by Fnatic.
As long as Sentinels remains a dominant team constantly in NA while the matches go either way in EU with 2 eu teams in top 4 at masters, you're the one delusional to think an entire region is better than another just because their best team in the region is also the best in the world. Just proves that in NA there's a really low chance of any team to beat Sentinels, while EU or KR already had upsets when FPX and Vision Strikers didn't make it to iceland.
How are they close in skill to any NA team when they shit on everyone. As i said, they dominate NA 90% of the time, which means that there's no NA team good enough to win a tournament against them... How does that make them similar in skill if they get shat on by sentinels all the time. While in KR, Nuturn won against vision strikers, F4Q won against vision strikers, actually their first ever lost series was against F4Q there. In EU, FPX didn't make it, the presumed top team of EU, Liquid beat Fnatic for Iceland, now Fnatic beat liquid... The skill level is closer in EU than in NA, just because the tournaments are going either way, while in NA it's just 1 sided for Sentinels for a long time already. Moreover, all the grand finals for Sen were 3:0s... Liquid vs Fnatic was a 3:2, the previous tournament, was a 3:1 for fnatic against liquid.
You're literally wasting your time preaching to him, because he cannot take out his head from his ***.
Sean Gares, @sgares, literally said the same thing. Region-wise he thinks that EU is better than NA, because EU has like 10 top teams and NA has like 5 ok teams. If you do not believe it, feel free to visit his twitch channel or twitter and watch his stream from yesterday. He was exactly talking about this.
To summarize it, in what he believes, especially for now: SEN > EU (as region) > NA (rest of it)
V1 beat Liquid with a sub they had played with for a week... with wippie they wouldn't have lost to Nuturn. Now I still think Fnatic would beat them after V1 would lose in the upper bracket final but that would mean V1 would place 3rd with wippie. Just consider that they were on match points for a few rounds on both maps with jammyz(who btw has always been a tier 2 NA player) and that with wippie, who is not only a better player and viper but he has been with V1 for months... Sen>FNC>V1>Liquid imo so NA top 2>EU top 2 imo
Liquid still didn't do much in any tournament prior to Challengers Finals. And even in Challengers 2 where they lost 3:1 against Fnatic, they most likely made it so far because of seeding, winning against BDS and some unknown team. Just like many teams get by the end of a tournament because someone does the job for them... But being in lower bracket while everyone gets knocked out of the upper bracket by the same dominant team, and beating them one by one, knocking them out of the tournament, just as V1 did, only proves that they are just better... It's sad for V1 that... just because they lost in the end, people will say that they were not good representatives, but when they won against liquid everyone was V1 so good, NA>EU etc...
Yeah like I was saying, neither Liquid nor V1 did shit before the Challengers Finals so the argument of "EU didn't have it's best teams" could also easily apply to NA with V1. Personally, I didn't think V1 was a top 2 team until they beat Liquid and now I'm uncertain. The thing about NA is that there is 1 consistent #1 team with Sen but the #2 team is constantly changing. After First Strike, 100T looked like the #2 or even #1 team in NA, then after NV beat Sen, they looked like a top 2 team, then FaZe looked like the #2 team after they dominated everyone but Sen and now V1 looks like the #2 team because of their lower bracket run in the Challengers Finals. With EU, FPX is always like top 3 but they have always been overshadowed by 1 or 2 teams. Before First Strike it was G2, after First Strike it was Heretics and Fnatic, then after Masters it was Acend and Heretics and now it is Liquid and Fnatic. Also you say Liquid just got good seeding but they won the EMEA finals, beating FPX and Fnatic. V1 is absolutely a great team and are 100% a top 5 team in NA(same goes for Liquid in EU) and they were great representatives but what I'm saying is Liquid and V1 aren't really top 2 teams in EU and NA but only made it to Iceland due to extremely recent success. In my mind, the team that have been consistently great for months like FPX, 100T and Envy all are better teams than Liquid and V1 cause anyone can have a good tourney at any given moment.
that's like saying that Andbox is better than Sentinels because they beat them 2-0 in Challengers 2 or BBG is better than Sentinels. You can't make such conclusions based on a single series, especially when it was Liquid's first game on LAN with quite inexperienced players other than Scream and Jamppi
I want to see teams like the new G2, Heretics, Acend, FPX etc compete against NA. I also want to see 100T, C9 and NV play against EU teams.
I personally think EU has a larger depth of good teams compared to NA while Sentinels could be the best team in the world. However, if Fnatic manage to beat Sentinels tomorrow then I'll be slightly disappointed as Sentinels are by far the best team in NA currently while you couldn't say the same about Fnatic
I can't wait for the new Heretics and G2 rosters. They're gonna be completely reworked and they'll have on goal until Masters Berlin. And the teams to beat will be fnatic and liquid. I want to see how every team will try to improve from watching iceland or playing in iceland. Europe after masters reykjavik will be different. I'm not sure whether fpx or any of these teams will still be top tier by the time the next masters rolls around but, I want to see C9B in masters. I'm a C9B simp. Idk I just like their personalities and how they play. Hopefully they practiced and got better during the break and can finally be a top tier roster(even though they already are, i want to see them at berlin).
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