VIPER NERF = HARBOR BETTER = BREEZE CHAMBER, SPLIT CHAMBER. ICEBOX CHAMBER, ASCENT CHAMBER(maybe).
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CHAMBER IS BACK
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bigboy [#4]delusion
chamber is getting another buff soon with either unlimited range trip or 2 trips so 🤷♂️ . you can kill the man but you can't kill the idea
kalayav_n [#5]harbor has regenerative walls, and alot better util then viper now with her shitty ass 1 molly and no pickup orb.
that didn't answer his question
unknown_trash [#11]But why is it chamber??
you can't have cypher who is passive information with harbor on the team, so you need a more aggressive comp surrounding harbor. thats why you don't see cypher harbor or like very passive agents paired with harbor otherwise harbor's value is just minimal.
benmaimoon [#8]liberals don't want you to know this comp
let me cook
Harbor
Clove
Chamber
Gekko
Yoru
every map spam this 👍
Based coming from you in May 2024. This gonna be meta in 2025 watch
benmaimoon [#8]liberals don't want you to know this comp
let me cook
Harbor
Clove
Chamber
Gekko
Yoru
every map spam this 👍
Pheonix
Reyna
Skye
Sage
Clove
Ekitten valorant on top
MrGovaere [#13]Based coming from you in May 2024. This gonna be meta in 2025 watch
-kaplan
-me next year 👀
kalayav_n [#12]you can't have cypher who is passive information with harbor on the team, so you need a more aggressive comp surrounding harbor. thats why you don't see cypher harbor or like very passive agents paired with harbor otherwise harbor's value is just minimal.
you dont see cypher harbor because solo harbor is just dogshit regardless
jackb2016 [#18]you dont see cypher harbor because solo harbor is just dogshit regardless
who said solo harbor? it was always 2 controller meta's on most maps...
kalayav_n [#12]you can't have cypher who is passive information with harbor on the team, so you need a more aggressive comp surrounding harbor. thats why you don't see cypher harbor or like very passive agents paired with harbor otherwise harbor's value is just minimal.
Killjoy has passive information aswell, her alarmbot is literally invisible until you hit it, and her tourret just watches a lane and spots players in line of sight. I don't know where did you get your logic but it seems like you just said a bunch of things like it made sense. Chamber trip is not that different from Kj's tourret or Cypher wires, and Viper Harbor worked insanely good because it's just too versatile, it can be played agressively, for example using Harbor cascades to flood into the site while defending, or you can play it insanely passive where you slice the map in ways where you give the enemy control over areas that are beneficial for them, but you playing behind the wall makes it very uncomfortable for them to do anything. A very obvious example is how Loud cut off themselves on Icebox on B, while defending. They put the Harbor wall as if it was a Viper attacking wall, giving you the plant and control of the front site, but they are all waiting behind it to spam and retake while you enjoy the small space they just gave to you. They did the exact same on Haven, walling themselves off on C giving you the plant, and the same with the Viper orb on A, giving you the free entry from long. And probably other maps, but I didn't watch all their games
TLDR: Viper nerf won't do anything to Chamber, and Harbor doesn't need a "aggresive comp" to work
Seoc [#21]Killjoy has passive information aswell, her alarmbot is literally invisible until you hit it, and her tourret just watches a lane and spots players in line of sight. I don't know where did you get your logic but it seems like you just said a bunch of things like it made sense. Chamber trip is not that different from Kj's tourret or Cypher wires, and Viper Harbor worked insanely good because it's just too versatile, it can be played agressively, for example using Harbor cascades to flood into the site while defending, or you can play it insanely passive where you slice the map in ways where you give the enemy control over areas that are beneficial for them, but you playing behind the wall makes it very uncomfortable for them to do anything. A very obvious example is how Loud cut off themselves on Icebox on B, while defending. They put the Harbor wall as if it was a Viper attacking wall, giving you the plant and control of the front site, but they are all waiting behind it to spam and retake while you enjoy the small space they just gave to you. They did the exact same on Haven, walling themselves off on C giving you the plant, and the same with the Viper orb on A, giving you the free entry from long. And probably other maps, but I didn't watch all their games
TLDR: Viper nerf won't do anything to Chamber, and Harbor doesn't need a "aggresive comp" to work
you just contradicted yourself...
Viper Harbor worked insanely good because it's just too versatile, it can be played agressively,
Also the reason chamber would work well in "aggressive" comps is because of his playstyle. You get the maximum value out of chamber if he is taking almost every single fight in every round. You cannot compare KJ and or CYPHER to CHAMBER because chamber is basically a fake sentinel. As for you saying harbor doesn't need a "aggressive comp" there is no such thing as a "aggressive comp" on paper but the way harbor's util is maximized is by the aggressive retakes/site takes.
kalayav_n [#22]you just contradicted yourself...
Viper Harbor worked insanely good because it's just too versatile, it can be played agressively,
Also the reason chamber would work well in "aggressive" comps is because of his playstyle. You get the maximum value out of chamber if he is taking almost every single fight in every round. You cannot compare KJ and or CYPHER to CHAMBER because chamber is basically a fake sentinel. As for you saying harbor doesn't need a "aggressive comp" there is no such thing as a "aggressive comp" on paper but the way harbor's util is maximized is by the aggressive retakes/site takes.
I didn't contradict myself, "It's just too versatile, it can be played aggressively...or you can play it insanely passive..." it clearly states it can be played both ways, and not how you said it needed an aggresivve comp around it. You are right with how good it is to take early fights with Chamber, when you win those engagements you can set up your Chamber on a aggressive sightline where he can get early info of enemies rotating, but don't you think teams know this already? The reason Jett and Killjoy work better than Chamber is because Jett already fufills that role you talk about, and Killjoy can fill the gaps with her passive hold. Also, do you think Chamber, an agent who excells with the Operator and aggressive sightlines would do good in a meta where teams run either 2 controllers or 2 initiators? In one hand you always have Viper who has insanely good reclear value, you can put your wall up on attack and slice the map to clear it easier with your initiator, making it easy to find a Chamber who would have got past your set up. And in the other hand, you have two initiators with also insane reclear value where they can just throw a Kay/o knife, Skye dog, Gekko flash, Sova drone and Chamber would be forced to teleport away. Harbor excells with reactiveness, that's why he's good in aggressive retakes or takes, but that doesn't mean his passive playstyle isn't good and definetly doesn't need an aggresive team
Seoc [#23]I didn't contradict myself, "It's just too versatile, it can be played aggressively...or you can play it insanely passive..." it clearly states it can be played both ways, and not how you said it needed an aggresivve comp around it. You are right with how good it is to take early fights with Chamber, when you win those engagements you can set up your Chamber on a aggressive sightline where he can get early info of enemies rotating, but don't you think teams know this already? The reason Jett and Killjoy work better than Chamber is because Jett already fufills that role you talk about, and Killjoy can fill the gaps with her passive hold. Also, do you think Chamber, an agent who excells with the Operator and aggressive sightlines would do good in a meta where teams run either 2 controllers or 2 initiators? In one hand you always have Viper who has insanely good reclear value, you can put your wall up on attack and slice the map to clear it easier with your initiator, making it easy to find a Chamber who would have got past your set up. And in the other hand, you have two initiators with also insane reclear value where they can just throw a Kay/o knife, Skye dog, Gekko flash, Sova drone and Chamber would be forced to teleport away. Harbor excells with reactiveness, that's why he's good in aggressive retakes or takes, but that doesn't mean his passive playstyle isn't good and definetly doesn't need an aggresive team
2 words, util to clear chamber. unlike a raze or jett you can get them off a line with maybe a fade dog but chamber can absorb every flash and dog or util until he FEELS extremely uncomfortable and tp back, no way a good chamber player would get pushed back with a single flash or what not. viper isn't gonna be completely gone she is viable in certain maps like breeze, icebox and maybe split. i can link you several vods from offseason tournaments to vct games and what not, you will rarely find a chamber player getting pushed back with just a single flash.
edit: forsaken vs yay, watch how they absorb and even take ridiculous decision making and still make it out as if shit was fine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmahy9iUyS4&t=954s
kalayav_n [#24]2 words, util to clear chamber. unlike a raze or jett you can get them off a line with maybe a fade dog but chamber can absorb every flash and dog or util until he FEELS extremely uncomfortable and tp back, no way a good chamber player would get pushed back with a single flash or what not. viper isn't gonna be completely gone she is viable in certain maps like breeze, icebox and maybe split. i can link you several vods from offseason tournaments to vct games and what not, you will rarely find a chamber player getting pushed back with just a single flash.
edit: forsaken vs yay, watch how they absorb and even take ridiculous decision making and still make it out as if shit was fine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmahy9iUyS4&t=954s
As I said, don't you think teams already know that? I know how good Chamber can be when he can tank every util you throw at him and teleport easily, but still isn't as versatile as Jett. Jett is way more mobile and reliable, she can smoke herself and isn't that easy to overwhelm. The reason the waterfall TP works on Lotus is because there's a big ass wall that is also thin enough to let you place your tp behind it and play in front, making it hard to get overwhelmed since the enemy has to go all the way around the wall, howhever not every map has a place like that.
But what does that all have to do with Viper nerfs, that's where what you say doesn't make sense. Chamber's capabilities are not going to increase with Viper nerfs, if anything he was the best at getting past the attacking Viper setup with his teleport, if Viper somehow doesn't get picked (which I doubt) teams will still pick KJ and Cypher, and go double initiator every map. Teams know how to util dump a Chamber and the Viper nerfs are not going to change that
Seoc [#25]As I said, don't you think teams already know that? I know how good Chamber can be when he can tank every util you throw at him and teleport easily, but still isn't as versatile as Jett. Jett is way more mobile and reliable, she can smoke herself and isn't that easy to overwhelm. The reason the waterfall TP works on Lotus is because there's a big ass wall that is also thin enough to let you place your tp behind it and play in front, making it hard to get overwhelmed since the enemy has to go all the way around the wall, howhever not every map has a place like that.
But what does that all have to do with Viper nerfs, that's where what you say doesn't make sense. Chamber's capabilities are not going to increase with Viper nerfs, if anything he was the best at getting past the attacking Viper setup with his teleport, if Viper somehow doesn't get picked (which I doubt) teams will still pick KJ and Cypher, and go double initiator every map. Teams know how to util dump a Chamber and the Viper nerfs are not going to change that
its not a flex to util dump 1 agent lol, you need util to hold back retakes on sites which are now literally the meta. anyway come back when chamber agent pick gets up by atleast 10%. I will comeback to this..
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