I think we're seeing the start of a rivalry...

AND IM ALL FOR IT

Neon obv broken but ur bigger problem is Zekken is gonna do the same thing on raze next map lmao

Something looking like he's gonna be Jett/Fade/Sova next year

https://tracker.gg/valorant/profile/riot/PRX%20something%23112/overview

its not real lol

But somehow this is : https://www.vlr.gg/340949/tsm-vs-yfp-gaming-challengers-league-2024-north-america-stage-1-ro12

real asf

https://x.com/symrifle/status/1803967613820698985

No matter what criteria you use, there are plenty of games harder than league

Reviving this so yall find more stuff

The consequence of long term phantom use

Its so good it makes you lazy

GOAT

On top of that he's playing the worst agent in the game in an experimental comp against what might be the best team in americas

can you clip it? this is an open source project 😂

https://x.com/JuniorXL4/status/1851713153706660007

I might have found the Sacy one, but I don't speak portuguese. Can you translate/confirm?

Can someone compile a master-list of every pro/coach that complained about neon, asked for nerf, etc. Tweets, Twitch Clips, Comments on a podcast, whatever.

Edit: Fuck it lets do it here

Zest - https://x.com/Zestvlrt/status/1848077216212824270

Riens - https://x.com/RieNsfps/status/1849422762898604403

C0m - https://x.com/C0Mtweets/status/1849463848983511452

Derke - https://x.com/Derke/status/1850946088632795465

TenZ - https://youtu.be/8WZnHzXM5w8?si=x_fwyiYhXUV7WCZG

Karon - https://x.com/Karonvlrt/status/1840739118126379311

NiSMO - https://x.com/NiSMO_VAL/status/1846577162121363753

Leaf - https://www.twitch.tv/tarik/clip/PiercingSmoggyPepperoniHumbleLife-r1SsTQ7DY71cFbEI

Zander - https://youtu.be/kGMYxIhahE4?si=wUixlDEIN8U0Gy6Z

FNS - https://youtu.be/VaRFAqUB5DU?si=6Z1gSKnLb5fMuonw

FNS 2 - https://youtu.be/5CKE6x9T8Qc?si=hvKaq3OvSuO8SkNj

Less - https://x.com/loud_less/status/1849281697868607999

Pancada - https://x.com/pANcada/status/1849281846187532659

Wo0t - https://x.com/WootVL/status/1851690454217297964

Keznit - https://x.com/keznitdeuS/status/1849927101333282876

Johnqt - https://x.com/1johnqt/status/1842325915713650694

Scream - https://x.com/ScreaM_/status/1839218082453004426

Zeek - https://x.com/zeekrino/status/1849355542663225601

Jakee - https://x.com/jakeeVAL/status/1844212437903606081

Zikz - https://x.com/Zikzlol/status/1849268459760410653

Avova - https://x.com/AvovAFPS/status/1848711970326716782

Bang (and Zander) - https://www.twitch.tv/bangzerra/clip/CleverPreciousAlbatrossCoolStoryBob-7MdBdvdZyYmzGizZ

Tex - https://x.com/texerino/status/1853184716205363558

Tex 2 - https://x.com/texerino/status/1853567152881578422

Marved - https://www.twitch.tv/marved6/clip/CautiousShakingNightingaleOpieOP-QeE8_CUVHwyCpFHy

Marved 2 - https://x.com/OkeanosQT/status/1849496535358190011

Zekken - https://x.com/zekkenVAL/status/1853849071171289245

Tenz - https://www.twitch.tv/tenz/clip/HonestBusyKathyNinjaGrumpy-KyVUZCazjxIHe-xV

Tenz 2- https://www.twitch.tv/tenz/clip/DependableDaintyPeanutDancingBaby-HoJJy6QK6UDTkWwK

Tenz 3 - https://x.com/TenZOfficial/status/1854495939836379341

Mada - https://www.twitch.tv/madaa/clip/SpineyRespectfulOilChocolateRain-d6qgLuB8rdUUHz6k

Saadhak - https://x.com/SaadhakW/status/1857446313656303885

Subroza - https://x.com/Subroza/status/1847427183418974238

snw/snwziN - https://x.com/snwzera/status/1849917847406842077

Koalanoob - https://x.com/koalanoob/status/1849459676406034777

Something - https://www.youtube.com/live/Pg2_Z_GZXqc?si=fXfwIm1QsEBQlxu2&t=225

Oxy gotta be in this discussion

people out here naming benjyfishy the goat cypher, someone has to set them straight

After they learned rollies were on the line and Boaster locked Yoru

at the end of the day it can't be proven, you're right

But we have multiple lines of evidence that heavily suggest it. 1 2

a fair and square win is a win

Did they really prove they were the best without any doubt? The Answer is a clear no.

the analogy of the injury is that the players could not participate

Obviously they can't participate, but that's where the similarities end. I don't like this injury analogy altogether because the potential for injury in physical sports is an inherent fact of life. Being denied a visa because of xyz is not. Saying 'oh well they're both just things out of your control' is grossly oversimplifying it.

https://youtu.be/xHYiDMKPUzI?si=IYow6yKKbaFQlXtX

Just watched the DRX game since DRX is the better team.

I took notes of every time Saadhak had impressive util, since we both know Ethan has better aim:
--------------------------
Round 1 - Good Molly - Forces Chamber TP

Round 5 - Good Flash - blinds the viper in pit and wins the round

Round 8 - Good Knife - well timed knife to stop the hit, but they still lose the round

Round 11 - Good Knife - same thing as R8, well timed knife to stop the hit but they still lose

Round 16 - Good Flash - Pop Flashes twice out of jett smoke incase the first one was dodged, gets a kill from it

Round 20 - Good Knife - Delays the retake to help the lurks end the round

Round 24 - Good Knife - confirms the location of 1 guy in the 2v2, winning the round/game

-----------------------------------
If this is one of his best Kayo performances then I gotta say that's not enough

How is saying he's not the GOAT cypher making him look bad

Which Champions Istanbul match should I watch

Yes but after that you said Saadhak had more rating, more acs (neither true), so I went and found the statistics. By statistics Ethan wins clearly.

By most people eye-test Ethan also wins

If one uncleared corner could turn the tide of an entire game, what about the countless kills that would have gone your way if you had the best player in your region at the time playing with you?

Like this is the most preposterous argument i've ever heard.

You're completely ignoring the entire concept of scale when you try to argue that missing out on huge factors for success are comparable to not clearing a single corner
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As an analogy, the Toronto Raptors won the NBA championship after KD got hurt and couldn't play. Everybody knows that if he didn't get hurt they would have won. Can they truly prove it? No, but everybody still knows it.

You're doing the equivalent of saying we don't know that because sometimes a single free-throw could decide an entire game. It doesn't even make sense.

Now lets take it further by acknowledging that not being able to compete because of injury in an IRL sport is not comparable to not being able to compete because you can't visit a country.

Ethan has better All time stats on KAYO

https://www.vlr.gg/player/727/saadhak/?timespan=all
https://www.vlr.gg/player/11225/ethan/?timespan=all

Better Rating, Better ACS, Better K/D, Slightly Better Assists Per Round
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you wanna look at both times they met:

Much Better KAYO at Tokyo: https://www.vlr.gg/event/stats/1494/champions-tour-2023-masters-tokyo?exclude=&min_rounds=0&agent=kayo

Much Better KAYO at Champs : https://www.vlr.gg/event/stats/1657/valorant-champions-2023?exclude=&min_rounds=0&agent=kayo
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you compare Saadhak's KAYO from when he won champs to Ethan's KAYO to when he won champs:

https://www.vlr.gg/event/stats/1657/valorant-champions-2023?exclude=&min_rounds=0&agent=kayo

https://www.vlr.gg/event/stats/1015/valorant-champions-2022?exclude=&min_rounds=0&agent=kayo

Ethan is much better

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you look at all time stats for KAYO players against good opponents (I chose '1950' rating, which I think is fair)

https://www.vlr.gg/stats/?event_group_id=all&event_id=all&region=all&min_rounds=200&min_rating=1950&agent=kayo&map_id=all&timespan=all

Ethan is much better
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you judge by Eye-test, Ethan is better

I mean it is a little early but he's so far ahead (literally won a championship on clove whereas nobody else even really plays her) that I think its fair to say it's him with no real competitors. Like look at this, and note the rounds as well: https://www.vlr.gg/event/stats/2097/valorant-champions-2024?exclude=&min_rounds=0&agent=clove

Derke hasn't come close to winning a tourney with Yoru, whereas Meteor's Yoru was a clear key to GENG's dominance on Breeze. Even with stuff that doesn't show up on the stat sheet like the tp's in spawn that keep you paranoid.

You need to rewatch EG vs Loud lowers Ascent

Don't even look at the stats, just watch the game and tell me who seems to be the better KAYO. It's pretty clear from pretty early on

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4wAoMfTtJo&list=PLMJ9cfx_WDdybdHDw28uCEFnxQvprJ59W&t=2424s

Rounds 4 and 7 in particular show the little things that Ethan does that make the difference in a big way.

he's a pretty good skye def not near goat of the agent. I'd take Leo's skye over Sacy's everytime and he's not even my pick

The best shotgun using Kayo forsure

he probably would have a decent case for #1 if he just played it more which is pretty absurd

it its by peak it could be demon1

but since his international debut aspas has been a min top 3 jett in the world at any point in time

the only people better at any point where - Optic Yay, EG Demon1, and MAYBE Ardiss/Texture - big maybe on those last two

alfajer

this year

do you know what could possibly be a bigger overall factor in deciding a game's outcome than not checking corner?

• Being able to play with the best player in an entire region, as you have the rest of the season
• Being able to practice with your star player who would in the near future end up as the best player in the world

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Not all injuries are preventable, but injury prevention and staying in shape (cough cough Zion Williamson) are factors that are in an athlete's control and that they are expected to take seriously (Lebron reportedly spends a million a year on his body). It's not at all comparable to getting a visa, which is not in your control and has nothing to do with your in-game performance.

If yay starts frying i'm gonna laugh so hard

upon further reflection I think you're right. updated it

Good call

but there is literally NO ONE in the world who can argue confidently that FNC or EG or PRX wouldve won tokyo with demon1 and something no visa issues

lol do you know who you typed this to?

players missing due to injuries are a thing in sports too

Staying healthy is an actual part of real life sports. It's not a good comparison to stuff like getting visas

The problem wasn't the 8 teams per se, but the level of play was extremely low compared to modern standards. Bob cousy (Russell's pg) made it to the HOF without being able to dribble with his left hand.

In 2021 Nats could literally walk up rope on icebox for free and it would blow everybodies minds: https://youtu.be/58Yuc0_-XUM?si=CJkqJYx6YRYjhBTI

You couldn't do this in an Asc1 lobby today

Both teams that had visa issues for their star players in Tokyo were in Champs finals a month later

That's the guy who was saying NRG 2024 was gonna be insane right?

dropped 275 ACS to Cypher diff Benjy and lift a trophy in front of him

https://www.vlr.gg/player/13039/meteor

will unironically tell you Benjyfishy is the greatest cypher ever then act like you're the idiot 😂😂😂

vlr really earned its reputation

Mb it was late

but seriously there is no aspect of KAYO that he clears Ethan in

Support Flashes? FUCK no
Flashing for self? no
General util? no
Fragging? only if you do it relative to your own time. If you take their peak and switch them out for each other, 2023 Ethan's dropping 27/8/15 every map and Acend's winning without losing a map. Put 2021 Zeek in Ethan's place and PRX (or Loud) is raising a trophy.

How your achievements hold by modern standards is important. If not Bill Russell or Wilt Chamberlain would be the GOATS of the NBA. But nobody seriously believes that, even if you respect their achievements.

If you don't think Alfajer has a case for GOAT cypher (its in the 'debatable' group), then you are clueless.

The people in group 1 are the Valorant Agent equivalents of asking who's the best 3-point shooter in basketball. If you think its anybody other than Steph Curry you're just wrong. There's nothing to debate

Listen its all good to support your countrymen and all that but get a grip bro

if its by peak then I still think Yoru should be Meteor and Cypher should be Alfa

rest looks good

First saying the first group is debatable and now this

Stop tryna be different bruh 😂😂😂

Marved and Mako have met in 3 series. Marved has won all 3 times. 3-0 Marved

In those series, Marved had a better overall rating once (by .15), Mako once (by .11), and they had an exact tie once. 1-1-1 Tie

In the one time they both played in an omen mirror matchup, Marved was better (by alot). 1-0 Marved

Marved has 3 finals appearances. 3-0 Marved

Marved has a Trophy. 1-0 Marved

Mako has been great for longer, but you can also rephrase that as Marved has achieved much more in much less time.

https://youtu.be/GCTvdm4XF4Y?si=CSDcb6I1_iVbCsrA

Whoops I don't know why I read that as Skye

Yeah if you think anybody is a better KAYO than Ethan you are delusional. That shit is not up for debate lmao.

Brimstone is easier for obvious reasons, but imo Astra still isn't as hard as you're making it out to be. And if anything lurking is easier than brimstone. If you lurk on brimstone that generally means you're not gonna be in position to play postplant lineups (not a problem for Astra postplant sucks). On top of that you're not limited by range and can recall smokes to get yourself places.

Getting solo, uncoordinated value out of astra - while harder than brim - is still straightforward (just smoke normally if you don't wanna do anything extra) and if you're decently comfortable on her (which I don't think is prohibitively difficult like yoru or something) on average she will be better than Brim, and a lot better for certain maps this act (Pearl, Abyss).