The state of t2

#1

Targu1n

Yesterday Acends CEO, Bencb, has made a sort of "farewell" post, talking about the current state of t2.
https://x.com/bencb789/status/1839249370824261989

I strongly recommend reading the original tweet.
Huge thanks to both him, and their Head of Esports Krimson, for openly talking with us about these issues from their viewpoint.

They also have a Youtube channel "Inside Esports" (https://www.youtube.com/@InsideEsports-n5v), where they will be, for example, discussing tier 2 Valorant in the future.

This post will add some more insights based on answers Bencb gave on Discord, as well as parts from Acends latest video "Why Acend Club is Leaving Valorant".

--------------

"We asked: What are the reasons for staying in valorant tier 2 and [...] we had one or two, but I think we had ten reasons speaking against staying in tier 2 Valorant [...]. Its very disheartening." (Bencb - 2)

spending $700,000 on our Valorant Team in 2 years to compete in T2

When asked if this was a reasonable investment, Bencb responded that in hindsight it was not. "We expected a better T2 system but looking back, I wouldn't pay more than 2k per player anymore.
Since it is 1-year franchise only anyway, no matter how skilled or experienced, I wouldn't even pay 500$ per player per month anymore" (3)

The drop in salaries is something noticeable across all of t2, across all regions, and is bound to continue in the current landscape.
"Orgs are forced to pay min salaries. Imo we overpaird in some cases because we wanted to support the players and have them focused on the competitive scene.
In Riots case, it already forced us this year to decrease tremendously and reject salary increases because it was not possible and justifable with the state of the system." (3)

When Riot reduced the 2 - year franchise slot to just one year, it felt like a slap in the face.

In the podcast, Krimson explains that they began reevaluating their investment in t2 after the changes for the minimum Ascension duration were announced.
Elaborating, Bencb explained that "its pointless winning Ascension and spend[ing] 700k+ to setup all the business structure in Berlin with players, teams, staff, content, facility just to leave after 1 year. Way to risky.
Esports is about sustainibility. It should be 3 years, 2 years is already a stretch and min 2 slots." (3)
This isn't an isolated case with other org owners, such as Ucams CEO Marco Mourão publicly criticizing the lack of security for Ascending orgs. (4)

What happened to the T2 scene? Is Riot understaffed? Do they not care? Or are the wrong people in charge? Any of these possibilities would spell disaster for building a sustainable T2 ecosystem. And trust me, it wouldn’t take much to fix, definitely not a lot of money.

He criticized Riot for "trying to build the franchise model from top to bottom." Specifically, he points out that he "believe[s] some people try to copy franchise because it works in other spots in America. [...] But what they forget, they have a very good T2 and T3 system." (3)

"There are obviously other systemic issues in Tier 2 that we have seen, with various newsposts that are coming out, where it appears that in a number of [...] [cases], offseason tournaments that have been canceled already. [...] There have been no, and there will be no games until February [for Acend]." (Krimson - 2)
Additionally, Bencb also points out that the current format has an additional 2 months of offseason for teams that don't make it to ascension. During this time it is nonviable to start building next year's roster, as teams don't know what player will be signed in t1/FA/RFA. (2)

Another worrying criticism that also gets brought up frequently is Riots unwillingness to talk to the organizations. "Start talking to Orgs. Right now, there is 0 communication." (3)
"I think we have a lot of good ideas, potentially, for fixing tier 2 and I hope that Riot sees the problems organizations are having." (Krimson - 2)

This leaves all the pressure on the underfunded, understaffed, and oftentimes seemingly overwhelmed TOs, to try and figure out how to fix their region while still in the bounds of Riots system.

In a side comment Bencb mentioned a more ideal t2, in his opinion, would be "one emea challenger league. 20 teams, can be 10 direct invites, 10 qualifiyng teams, Only 1 league, much bigger viewership, more competitive, play ins and play offs in nov/dec. Ascension winner crowned in early december."
He also voiced his support for an Open League with more slots for teams.

While not brought up as a reason for their departure, when asked what games Acend would be looking towards in the future, Bencb explained that Acend will "only compete in Games where we dont have restrictions with sponsors as we do have it in LOL, Valorant or other Riot Games [as Acend pivots into better monetization models]."
This once again brings up the concern that Riot's restriction on sponsors makes it even harder for t2 orgs to be sustainable, despite Riot being largely unwilling to support t2 (in both Val and LoL).

(1) https://x.com/bencb789/status/1839249370824261989
(2) "Why Acend Club is Leaving Valorant" https://youtu.be/SXG77L0782Q
(3) Acend Discord Q&A
(4) https://x.com/marco_esports/status/1804278976124191076

#2

ParisVLR

7

Frags

+

–

Let’s face it T2 EMEA is dead. T2 NA is dead. T2 is dead in general,

#5

Targu1n

0

Frags

+

–

Ye it aint pretty

Ill be watching Apac closely the next 2 years
I think their model is a huge risk right now (lots of downsides of essentially losing t2 in a lot of countries), however it might be the way forward for other regions too

#11

ParisVLR

1

Frags

+

–

It’s just bad when you have so many teams that are exiting the secne

#14

Targu1n

0

Frags

+

–

yup has a huge chance to collapse t2 this year

worst thing is Apac doesnt even have a t3 scene to fall back on like EMEA does
its all in for them

#19

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

how is apac different from emea/americas?

#21

IonlywatchvcjXD

0

Frags

+

–

I cannot say about others' but in Japan:

( top to bottom)
franchising
Ascension
VCL / tier 2
Premier / tier 3 or offline tournaments ( high school, college etc you can argue they are lower than premier)

#22

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

so basically you compete in the VCL to get into ascension and there you have to fight different regions?

#23

IonlywatchvcjXD

0

Frags

+

–

If you wanna get in franchsing? Yeah

#24

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

feels kinda weird, aren't some regions stronger by default thanks to a more developed scene?

#25

IonlywatchvcjXD

0

Frags

+

–

What's weird about it ? Pls explain 😅

continue thread →

#27

Targu1n

0

Frags

+

–

ye from Riot side theres no difference
However a couple of EMEA regions had t3 leagues that would qualify you into t2 (see the invited teams in https://www.vlr.gg/event/1943/challengers-league-2024-northern-europe-polaris-split-1/closed-qualifier, who won https://www.vlr.gg/event/1917/beacon-2023-open-split-2-finals for example)

so in EMEA even if t2 merges and absolutely flopps there would at least be some sort of existing structure to fall back on

#30

Nef0r0

1

Frags

+

–

got it, thanks for explaining

#15

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

well yeah, NA can potentially have 3 big orgs leaving in one year (oxygen, m80, tsm), it's also wild how the brazilian scene has no imperial, no pain.

#3

Targu1n

0

Frags

+

–

Tweet in text form:

Perspective from a CEO spending $700,000 on our Valorant Team in 2 years to compete in T2:

What would you do if after pouring $700,000 into a dream, you found out it was never built to last?

(if you are an esports fan, player or somehow involved in esports, I appreciate a like and retweet for awareness)

That’s exactly the reality we faced as we sought to compete in Tier 2 Valorant.
When Riot reduced the 2 - year franchise slot to just one year, it felt like a slap in the face.
That’s when we began to reconsider our place in the game. We weren’t alone - others felt it too.

After winning champs in 2021, we were invited to apply for the VCT Franchise. It felt like everything was coming together. We even secured a final 20 spot and flew to Berlin to pitch our plans in front of the decision-makers.
But we didn’t make the cut.
Surprisingly, we weren’t too upset. Why? Well, the competing orgs had a lot more experience, a bigger fanbase, and significantly larger budgets.

Let me be clear: our impression of the Riot staff was excellent.
They were professional, passionate, diligent, and extremely friendly.
But once we descended to T2, everything changed. That’s when the nightmare began. You see, fighting for just one slot across all of Europe isn’t just difficult - it’s ruthless, but potentially extremely rewarding.
We knew we could make it and we came damn close in year one of competing in T2 by finishing #3 in Ascension.

Teams, including ours, poured money, time, and heart into the competition, paying good salaries and making massive sacrifices.

Let’s be honest: T2 Valorant has only existed for two reasons:

Players grinding to make their way up.
Orgs like ours investing in those players, hoping to compete for that elusive slot.

Without the franchise system as a goal, would T2 even exist? I don’t think so.

What happened to the T2 scene? Is Riot understaffed? Do they not care? Or are the wrong people in charge? Any of these possibilities would spell disaster for building a sustainable T2 ecosystem. And trust me, it wouldn’t take much to fix, definitely not a lot of money.

We’ll be diving deeper into this mess in our next podcast episode with @KrimsonAer
and @ElevatedSpeaks
, discussing the changes needed for a better T2 ecosystem. Stay tuned.

As for us? Competitive Valorant is a closed chapter for now. The mismanagement of tournaments, broadcasts that don't appeal to the majority, low viewership, prize money delays (even casters waiting for their 2023 payments!), a lack of communication, and the cancellation of Split 3 tournaments. It all got worse.

If we ever return, it’ll either be in a massively profitable situation (finding a low - budget team with a lot of potential) or in a more sustainable ecosystem.

But the harsh reality is, T2 Valorant has been a slap in the face, not just for orgs like ours, but for the players too. They sacrifice their time and lives chasing the dream of going pro, while countless people behind the scenes, coaches, management, editors, designers, work tirelessly for the same goal.

And let’s be real, they aren’t getting rich from it; for most, it’s pure passion. At times, it feels like we are being exploited. Too many people work in this industry for “an apple and an egg” (a German saying .. you get the point).
Yet, for many, working in esports is the dream. That said, I’ve also seen the opposite. People in critical roles being massively overpaid while delivering incompetence that ruins the progress for everyone.
Esports deserves better. Valorant deserves better. Maybe Riot’s focus is on T1. Maybe the higher-ups are unaware of what’s going on. Maybe things will change. But right now, it’s a disaster for orgs.

It's an even worse system for the players. We can pivot to other games or opportunities.
But the pro players? They’re stuck. They’ve dedicated years to mastering this game, and learning another from scratch could take years more.
They’re the ones being hit hardest. I truly feel for the countless unsigned T2 teams and players who deserve to make a living in this space.

Whether you're an org owner, an esports worker, or a player unsure of your next step - join our Discord.
Let’s continue the conversation, reach out if you want to chat, need help, have ideas. Maybe together, we can find a way forward.

You're not alone.

Stay strong, Ben

Holy yap ik. I found the answers interested so thought Id share them here and maybe someone else does too^^

#4

x_knowitall39_x

0

Frags

+

–

Yeah it’s a skill issue

#6

Demon1_The_GOAT

2

Frags

+

–

Wait Ascension franchising is only 1 year now and no longer 2 years?????

If RiotValorant doesn't have a sound and approachable Tier 2 system structure, Valorant will die out eventually since there won't be much potential growth over the years with new players receiving decent salary. If the motive dies, its over.

#7

Targu1n

0

Frags

+

–

yea its part of the change that gives a chance for teams to extend their stay if they make it to champs (and also them reducing the amount of slots in tier 1, but dont say that part out loud)

#16

bronzil_enjoyer

0

Frags

+

–

all these to make china #1 region because cn tier 2 pays good

#8

IHaveAnswers

0

Frags

+

–

more ideal t2, in his opinion, would be "one emea challenger league. 20 teams, can be 10 direct invites, 10 qualifiyng teams, Only 1 league, much bigger viewership, more competitive, play ins and play offs in nov/dec. Ascension winner crowned in early december."

Apart from the time mentioned, I think this is a better system on paper. But again I am not from EMEA or watch the regional EMEA challengers so I wouldn't know what would be the effects on viewership or community.

#9

Targu1n

1

Frags

+

–

Its hard to judge how it'd impact the region

At least from how I see it this push for a single league comes more from a place of (almost) every league being fucked beyond belief.
An easy example is always the prize money. Its already low in emea, but there are a whole lot more leagues except east who have not paid this years split 1. There are some who havent even paid last years.

The combined league would at least have the potential to be "profitable" (in an esports sense - you aint gonna make money) for the orgs involved, since viewers would be way higher.

#33

IHaveAnswers

0

Frags

+

–

Bump! Cuz I think this would be a great change 🥰

#34

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

I mean I like it as well, it makes vct look like actual sports league with premier division 2nd division and relegation

#10

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

tier 2 is just dead now, no going back

#12

IHaveAnswers

1

Frags

+

–

A question, the transcript mentions that riot has restrictions on certain types of sponsors, is it refering to gambling sponsors or is it something else?

#13

Targu1n

0

Frags

+

–

yea Acend has close ties to https://x.com/raiseyouredge (bio: "Nr. 1 Poker Training Site, having helped 100k+ people.")
https://www.vlr.gg/team/2577/raise-your-edge Acend was originally tied to that site, but Riot said no so we got the Acend brand instead

#17

badvibrations

2

Frags

+

–

Congrats, Leo Faria

#18

IonlywatchvcjXD

1

Frags

+

–

You can add Jake Sin too

Kohei if you're reading this, I'm sorry for hating on you,compared to others you seemed like a god ( although I have no idea how much of VCJ's successes can be attributed to you 😂😂.)

#20

Nef0r0

0

Frags

+

–

I feel like this guy is just the wildest cs fan who wants to destroy vct

#35

IHaveAnswers

0

Frags

+

–

Also, I hope riot instead of fiddling with each other's balls reaches out to orgs in T2 to discuss and make a better T2 model. I am sure orgs would want to have a discussion about it too

#36

IHaveAnswers

0

Frags

+

–

Bump! 🥰