There are certain things that are meta independent that teams in 2025 are simply better at.

You're using LOUD 2022 coz a lot of the players from that team are still relevant today, but let's make a comparison to say Sen 2021 and you'll understand what I'm saying. You can't seriously tell me that any good teams from the franchising era wouldn't simply wreck Sen 2021 because their understanding of the game has just improved so much.

Another thing that makes players and teams better in 2025 is because over the years they've played against so many different kinds of playstyles that their reactions when they see something they haven't seen before. Teams in 2025 know everything that teams know everything teams in 2022 did plus 3 years of extra experience, so they would still beat Loud 2022 even if they were chucked into the 2022 meta. This is basically the same thing as the chess thing you said.

There are more things I wanna say but I'll leave that for your response coz I don't want the comment to get too long.

GenG 24 mid diffs all the other teams you mentioned and all top 2 teams from masters and champs in 2025 mid diffs GenG 2024 and low diffs the other teams

The later year teams would still win because there are things teams are doing in the later years that are meta independent that teams in earlier years simply didn't do

edit: grammar

That's a bad comparison. Player skill isn't improving in sports that have existed for decades at the same rate as it is improving in Valorant that has existed for only five years.

Coach's and player's understanding of the game simply just gets better year by year. Things like ult cycling only started late 2023 by the very top teams, and by 2024 pretty much every team was doing it. Same with pistol round snowballing. Teams in 2022 would simply get wrecked by this.

Prime 2022 Loud is prime because they destroyed the average of their time. When the average is constantly improving year by year, you know the teams that are considered prime in later years would simply destroy the prime teams in earlier years.

TLDR- false equivalence

The issue with these discussions is you need to clarify whether you're asking "Which team was the best at their prime relative to the teams they played against at the time" or "In a competition between all these best teams at their prime, who would win". The answer for the first question is simply just 2021 Reykjavik Sentinels, they didn't drop a single map that tournament, close second is 2023 Tokyo Fnatic I think. The second question raises another question which is "What meta are they playing with", because a lot of teams were successful on a particular meta and not necessarily as good on other metas. The other issue is that teams on average just get better year by year, i.e., most 2025 teams would wreck most 2023 teams.

TLDR- Difficult to answer because parameters for the question aren't well defined

Six Karma is a Mexican team which is NA

It's Pacific bottom seed every time too

Valyn and Jawgemo said the same thing on Platchat

After DRX beat MIBR yesterday:

1. They are minimum 4th place, so the DRX 5th-6th curse is broken
2. MIBR finishes 5th-6th, so the Aspas top 3 champs guarantee is also broken
3. The Heretics curse wherein the 2 teams that beat Heretics in the tournament finish 1st and 3rd is also broken

With this 1 win DRX have successfully broken:

1. The 5th-6th curse
2. The Aspas top 3 champs curse
3. The Heretics 1st - 3rd curse

Pretty huge honestly.

PRX didn't choke today, they made sure they lost, so that they can beat Heretics in the lower bracket to activate the Heretics curse that guarantees them 1st / 3rd place. And since aspas always makes 3rd place at champs, it's now confirmed that PRX are winning it all.

Y0y

One of the greatest Bo3s I've seen ever

EDG maintained their form from Champs all the way through kickoff and into Bangkok where they came 3rd place lol. Can't call that a fluke.

Only one team in the entire VCT history has been able to win more than one international tournament. That team was FNATIC

Sen have won twice too. But ig the point you were tryna make is winning twice in the same year.

0/10

I'm ngl I see it too

It's been 2 years dum dum

Imagine winning all 10 group stage games and still not qualifying to champs lmfao. Would be so sad lol.

Why, what happened now

Cricket sometimes. Got a bit into basketball as well earlier this year but not too much.

I agree with both things you said, I just think if East Asia was a region, the teams would improve really quickly. I think Japan would get good really quick too.

Imagine if Korea and Japan joined VCT CN to form VCT East Asia. Region would dominate so hard honestly. And we could get rid of all the mid teams in China.

Imagine if Korea and Japan joined VCT CN to form VCT East Asia. Region would dominate so hard honestly.

Biggest mwzera glazer- trembolonaRage

No, GenG are out of champs contention. Right now the competition is between Talon and DRX for the 4th APAC spot

Why does anyone move anywhere

Yeah she wants to get into med school or something

Yes he's indian origin (Gujarati) born in Tanzania and grew up in Canada

Furia would be -5 map differential and EG and 2G would be -6

What's funny is, after all this, Furia could still qualify to playoffs if they 2-0 EG next week

Brazil is almost as big as the US, they have all sorts of people lmfao

There is a sizeable community of Japanese descended people in Brazil

Honestly I was thinking of the exact same thing, you just put it into an articulate post, so thanks for that.

One thing I'd mention is APAC should be extended to include OCE as it is currently, so if a cracked player from these parts joins Tier 1, they can slot into an APAC team without taking up an import slot, and eventually if an OCE org steps up they could take up one of the team slots.

Another thing would be to extend SA to the entirety of LATAM so the region can include the Central American countries as well.

Oklahoma City Thunder in NBA as well

I play on laptop and hover between 60 and 120 fps

I'm Bronze 2 peak and currently

Why do the EMEA teams all have the general Europe flags but the teams in other regions have the flag of whichever country their org is based in

Yeah in a broader sense they're both gun replacement ults that function really well in unison with the agents other abilities.

I think Jett ult should have the same cost as Neon ult as they both function in similar ways

Brim needs a buff not a nerf wtf lol

KRU making it to Champs last year was such bullshit, they made it through because of the flawed champs points system. If they had this years champs points system 100T would've made it instead and honestly they would've been more interesting than whatever KRU did. KRU are literally the FUT of Americas.

I reckon the way to play defense is to have 3 on A and the other 2 in B and mid. Just hold if they hit A and play retake for B

How much ever you disagree with the circumstances surrounding the tournament (I'm not a fan of the Saudi sportswashing either), all the teams are going to be trying their absolute best to win unlike other random offseason events because of the gigantic prize pool.

Alfa would've broken it if the game went map 5

99 kills on 4 maps is crazy work

I mean sure Alfa was the best player in the finals but giving him the MVP would have been bittersweet at best and would have felt more like a consolation.

I don't think he cares about being MVP when his team fought so hard and lost such a big final. I think he would have felt like shit and he would 100% trade the MVP for the tournament win in a heartbeat.

I think it's always better to award the MVP to a player from the winning team regardless of how the players from the losing team performed.

Yes

I predicted a PRX vs FNC final correctly but wrong about everything else

I understand the MIBR - Trace argument but purely off of objective tournament placement Sen should be higher than Liquid. Farming China isn't really a valid argument looking at how high Wolves have placed.

Why is Trace higher than MIBR?

Also Sen should be higher than Liquid too right?

According to the Heretics curse, 1 of PRX and Wolves will come first and the other will come third.

So whoever wins G2 vs Fnatic will finish second place