It's hard to see the value an igl brings to a team, as the only stats we have is paper stats.

The Cned and friends thing, we have that with pretty much any team that has a crazy top heavy op user. C9/SEN are Tenz and friends. It's been like that in other games aswell. G2 on siege was Ctzn and friends, the first iteration of BDS was shaiiko and friends, etc.

Bonecold does seem like he needs to improve his mechanics, however if that takes away his focus on igling. It would be better to chill where he is.

OKay.
South africa might not have a huge esport community. So why dont they get insulted for their country standing in other sports?
Why dont people hate thaiiland? They're not a first world country, much like quite a lot of asia. So why dont people hate on their community for their economic standing?

People dislike the BR community because of the minority of fans who send death threats, and take it too far. The reason I brought up SA, is because nobody gives a fuck how developed a country is. Even in other sports, Rugby, Cricket. Nobody gives a fuck that South Africa is underdeveloped. Hell, even in football nobody in EU dislikes brazil because their region is underdeveloped. Shit, growing up I never heard any hate towards the brazil football team, nothing but love. Just the esport fans are the equivalent of Ronaldo and Messi superfans. A small minority ruin it for the majority.

If I run into a group of people that I have little to no positive experience with, I'll say it's a toxic community. I dont give a fuck if their country is insanely deveveloped like SK or JP. I dont give a fuck if they run pcs in slums like SA. A countries economic standing holds 0 hate. It's just an insult we use against other people.

People in EU talk about poland and romanias economy, we talk about UK with brexit. We literally shit talk with what information we get online. nobody cares if a country has favelas, townships, ghettos, etc. People just use them as insults rather than caring.

You're honestly reading far too much into people shit talking a region. People just shit talk for the sake of it.

I'm not saying there aren't people who have a huge distain for other regions. I've met a few who are xenophobic racist POS, and I cut ties once I heard of that. However not everyone that shit talks Brazil, or India. Have the intention of hating them because they're underdeveloped. To most people a countrys standing is just ammunition for trash talk.

400dpi .691 .82scoped

Using a widely known exploit that two previous pro teams were punished for, shouldn't be a slap on the wrist. Them losing the map, or replaying the half is the best choice. They're lucky they aren't DQ'd from the event, which other esports would do for a bug exploit that teams have been punished for in the past.

It could be it slipped Jhows mind, or it could not. We dont know the truth. The only truth we know is an exploit was used. If they replay, which I hope they do. Then nice. however either way, they can't go on acting like it never happened.

the thing is, if nobody gets punished for this, it wont stop. It wasn't that long ago when hiko had to hire bodyguards in brazil because of the hate he got. It was only like 2 years ago where leaf, a 16 year old received death threats. Even 3 months ago asuna received them.

Now I'm not saying what zombs said is fine. He'll most likely receive a fine, and possible suspension by riot. There's a chance for that. I just hope he isn't made to sit out of the event, because then we wouldn't see sentinels perform at their peak. I'd rather him get a punishment after the event, than before.

riot also need to sort their rulings out. Breaking momentum with furia, is unfortunate. We dont know if they'd have won with it, or not. However we'll never know.
Their ruling with Vk, although they were playing better, and were the better team. They should have to ff the map like giants, and x10 did. Either the map they won, or the map in the next series.

tbh neither deserve it. Nobody deserves death threats.

What I think vyltx is trying to say, but not well. Is how one got it because they played a match and riot fucked up. The other got it because they're involved in fights on twitter.

Again, neither deserver it. nobody deserves death threats for playing a fucking game, or talking online. Overall stupid situation.

all good all good bro :)

Bro, he literally replied to my comment.
I see him reply to my comment, so I assume he's talking to me. not by fault he scrolls to the bottom of my comment and hits reply.

Mechanically, I'd say marved is the best astra overall. He has good util, good mechanics, etc. Zombs is a better util astra though. His usage of util is insane compared to the region. It's why when it comes to being a controller, he's a better controller. A better player, I'd say marved.

It's genuinely a toss up if you prefer mechanics with a solid util rating. Or a great util rating.

Bro, anyone can tell he's on about their valorant scene, not the actual country.

In CS when EU says NA is trash, we're not talking about little timmy who is 7years old going to buy candy. We're on about their competitive scene.

nah, this time you can tell he was angry. Think it was on daprs stream a few hours ago when he saw the watch tweet. Dude saw the drink behind it and said he was drinking.

The tweet spree was easily a buildup of not being able to take all the berating and hate. Dont blame him tbh, but also people need to realise zombs is probably the biggest troll out of the sen5. Dude talks so much shit on stream and you can never tell if he's serious or not, because his voice is monotone.

dogshit vlr laggin making me post a reply as a comment. fml

Did you watch the matches today/yesterday. He wasn't dropping 15 a match. However he also wasn't just rolling over and dying. impact on a character isn't always paper stats. we dont know the impact he can bring behind the screen.
We say he's one of the best astras, because he's proven that.
Look back at previous events, and the previous lan matches. His stats aren't great. However stats on his role aren't always meant to be great.
Marved is probably the best mechanical controller in Na right now. his stats aren't that much better than zombs. 1.05kd vs 1.0.

However I do agree that Zombs would be the first person to be replaced on the team. It will either him being replaced, or shaz retiring. The other 3 will most likely stay longer than Zombs will.

But again, my main emphasis is on the impact we dont know he has, and can only assume. Same reason Bonkar hasn't been kicked, despite being the worst current pro player in valorant as a whole. His impact as an igl is enough for the team. Maybe zombs impact as a controller is enough, idk.

How do I read wrong?

"Dude, did you create a new account just to talk shit about Brazil or is it my impression? if not sorry."

Did I create a new account? No my account is 6 months old.
Do I shit talk brazil. I've spoken about brazil in the past few hours as they've been a common topic in the posts. Did I shit talk the region? no. Did I talk about the fans, yes.

It does look like you're wrong. So I accept the apology. ty have a nice evening.

shit like this is what fuels teams aswell. Look at CoD or Gears of war comp. The rivalries and actual hate people have for each other makes a fucking fantastic viewing experience.

Just thank god the bandwagon tsm fans left to join sen. Cringy kids jumping from one shit to another.

Neither of them are better in terms of util usage. Nitro, by far better mechanically. Vanity, mechanically too tbh. Util wise, Zombs is probably NAs best Astra.

I can see how vanity is close to him and marved in performance. All 3 are by far the top 3 controllers in Na.

It's what always set zombs out from the rest. He wasn't a mechanical player, but util was always perfectly timed, and executed well.

ye bro, my account made 6 months ago is new just to farm impressions.

idk if you mean to respond to the guy above, but nowhere in this thread did I shit on brazil. I'm a fan of their teams, but not fans. Much like every other region. I'm not a fan of any other regions because the shit talk tends to be cringy. Shit talk between pros is what I'm a fan of. CoD and gears of war are fantastic for this.

but ye, idk what you're on about lol

Fuck that's aweful. Anyone sending that kind of shit is a degen on levels so fucking low. Actual cretins sending death threats. Can tell their whole existance is based off their parasocial relationship with their favourite players/team. dudes who send that shit need to touch some grass.

Envy - all good

Earning from events isn't what they live off of. Salaries from large orgs is the majority of his income. Not including the wsb he does.

It's something people dont realise. Shahz said the prizepool isn't a lot of money for them. Their salaries are probably 1/3rd the prize pool they get, after their cut.
First place in this event is like 350k. Split between 6 people, each gets around 60k. Taxes will take it down to 40/50 something thousand. These players most likely get at least 5k a month, if not double, triple, quadruple that. I believe it's faker(I know how large he is. Not saying they're on the same level), who gets around 1mil or 1.2mil a year in salary. That's not including sponsorships, prizepool, etc.

In terms of util usage, zombs is by far the best. Mechanics and util, marved is another type of beast.

I wish NA cs somewhat comes back, but on the other hand I dont. I dont wanna see players jump back to CS from val. I'm just wondering if Nitro going back is worth it.

ngl I'd say marved is NAs best astra atm. Mechanically that is. After that probably nobody.
However anyone saying zombs gets little impact is a clown stuck in g3 thinking scoreboard stats mean the most.

no shot. They'll be a 10-20, but I can't see them getting into top 10 by just picking up nitro, vini/osee (not sure if liquid are still looking at vini. remember reading reports they were) , and shox, getting them into top10.

Then again, I could be talking out my ass. I just feel in my gut they wont last long past a honeymoon phase.

aaah ye ye I get you. It is weird to go from irl regions/countries to esports version of it. A lot of people still think EU in esports is the European union.

I thought in terms of valorant and riot, brazil is a region and latam is the other region.

It's true. G2 is by far the smartest brand when it comes to shit talk. It's why G2 never shit talk BR teams as they do with other teams like he does with eu.

I think sen are trying so hard to be the villains and make it interesting by being a bad guy. However it just doesn't look entertaining, where as g2 are.

Sen are just the btec budget g2 on twitter.

Sen are trying to be the NA g2. Tring to make jokes and cracks at everyone trying to play the villain of esports. Them going and being all nice and asking for people to be nice, wouldn't be within their brand media persoanlity.

tbh zombs barely streams, and when he does it's to like 1-3k people. No shot his streaming got him that watch. Salary and events would have got that.

TO get a watch that much, you need to be a huge streamer.

It's somewhat the same in eu/na. Salaries and sponsorships eclipse prize earnings, so it's mostly bragging rights.

Edit: also calculating by earnings is dumb. NA had far more development and funding in the past year of val, compared to other regions.

tbh viper at launch was same tier as yoru. Only before iceland was she buffed as fuck. They literally took an F tier agent and made them S tier at the time.

Just cant pass forward when your two attackers are ahead of the last defender.

Say there's A, B and C. C is defender.
If A(has ball) passes to B, who is infront of C. It's offside. Now if A is behind B who is behind C. You can pass.

I dont care if people copy. It's just the irony of shit talking strats, then using it and acting like you knew it was always good.

dont forget when 100t called Fnatic strats dogshit, then used them and 13-0 their next game.

Sentinels are just the new version of TSM.

They were far ahead of everyone else in y1, but other teams caught up and they fell off.

Sen were ahead of everyone at the start of this year, and now others have caught up. Getting a coach is the right thing, as shahz honestly can't do everything anymore. That shit can burn anyone out.

Oh I agree. EU has so many different counties, cultures, etc. FOr isntance I've ran into far more toxic french players than turkish. Across every game I've ran into more tilting french players than anything.

EU is far worse than the turkish playerbase. This is just the first game I've actually ran into a lot of turkish players., so my pool of experience is limited to valorant. French players ,or even uk players(Fucking hate uk players. Huge egos, for being a hardstuck.). EU overall is by far worse than turkey. I was just talking about why some people dislike turkey. It's nothing to do with the country. Just more to experiences they've had in games.

Have a nice day dude. I do agree with you with everything you said. My whole point is every region is toxic, and nobody cares if a country is actually poor or not. People just use that to shit talk.

I agree. I dislike a lot EU fans aswell.

Re-read what I typed. I'm saying every region attacks peoples countreis as a way to shit talk. nobody hates ona region because their country is underdeveloped.
I also spoke further up about EU hating on itself. Uk shit talk FR, Fr shit talk uk, we shit talk German, polish, italian, swedish, etc. Everyone shit talks everyone. It's why I'm not treating EU as victims in this whole thing. WE shit talk, we deserve to get shit talked back.

I also mentioned turkish players in ranked, as it was anecdotal to my experience. I haven't had a good experience with them in ranked. In real life, they're amoungst the most chilled people I know. On valorant ranked, I've never had a good experience. It's 100% anecdotal to my experience.

Again, every region is toxic to other regions. Some regions are toxic in their own region. People just can't say that a region is only toxic on another because they're underdeveloped. People hate on regions because teh fans tilt them, so they try to tilt them back.

Nobody hates these countries because of their real world development level. It's the fans intereaction why people dislike them
When BBL was top of the TR scene, the people shit talking other eu teams saying Aimdll going to aimdiff KEK, or when SMB was on a rise, they shit talked other teams. Same shti happened in CS with woxic and xantares.

indian people on this website were treated the same way sen/tsm/wardell/tenz fans were treated. They have a good player, and hyped the living fuck out of them.

Nobody hates india because they're an underdeveloped country. People just use that as a way to shit talk.

Nobody gives a fuck about a countries standing. It's fans that amke people dislike a region. Why do you think nobody hates thaii teams? They're an underdeveloped reigon, but nobody hates on them. Why? Because their fans aren't obnoxious. It's why people on CS hate french fans, people on siege dislike NA fans.

Yeah. I can't see anyone in t1 BR cs swapping. Not enough money in the scene at the moment. I'd love to see players like fallen, or coldzera swap. Dont think they ever will though. They can both perform in t1/2/3 cs for a long time coming.

SAme. I dont mind the region or the people there. I've played with a few BR guys in mmos. Most of lovely people.

Just they can't really play victim when it comes to shit talking or when it comes to fps games, considering they find it a troll to send death threats.

The ruling with VK is dumb. A replay of the 2nd half should be played, but that's all I can hope for. Just fans can't see things level headed, and just go straight for the attack on a team who didn't even report it, and even said VK deserved the win.

There's freaks all around. SOme NA people have done fucked up shit, some EU.

Just people need to see the difference between sending death threats, then playing victim because nobody likes your region. Making excuses like "it's because were a poor country. or underdeveloped" is bullshit. People dont like other regions because of fans. In siege nobody likes EU because their fans were cringy and arrogant. In CS it was BR because they still live in 2017, and also sent death threats to a 16yr old who sent their favorite team to the gutter.

Just people need to see that death threats make things personal. Shit talking someones country is mostly done for the sake of shit talk. Nobody honestly cares about if a country is good or bad. No country in the world is perfect.

Bro, do you play in EU ranked?
Do you run into turkish players online every day you play a game? That's my metric. Although it's anecdotal, every since opinion on any region online is anecdotal, as we dont have any actual statistics.
Also if you go back and read, I know it's hard. I said "IVE RAN INTO" I dont need a metric for personal experience with a group of people I've ran into. I stated it as anecdotal.

Also what is entitled about it? Do I think I'm entitled to something someone else has? no. I'm saying the fact that underdeveloped countries are hated upon because of the economic development, is a push.

People dislike brazillian fans because they sent a 16year old death threats because he railed them in a csgo match. They send death threats to anyone they dont like, or agree with. That's why people dislike them.
Why isn't there a huge hate for south africans? They're not a first world country. They're also the 2nd highest murder capital in the world.
I'm bringing up SA because I was born there, and have never once heard anyone hate on the country because they're not first world.

Just not everything is a real hate for the country. It's the hate for the fans. EU dont hate on underdeveloped countries because they're underdeveloped. They hate on countries because of the fans, and use the countries situation as a base for shit talk. It's done with everyone. EU > Na school shooting NA>EU teeth/ww2 is brought up all the time. EU/NA>RUS putin and slav stereotypes.
Everyone>NA hillbill rednecks. Peoiple use stereotypes that they can think of to shit talk anyone. it's been the nature since the start. Now do they send death threats, no. DO they use a country setting to shit talk, yes. The thing is keeping personal hate separate from general shit talk. From experience Brazillians cant. You guys are literally the kpop fans of the esports world.

A tldr list of why regions dislike brazillian fans.

Regions banter against eachother, shit talking the country. EU makes ufn of NA gun crimes, and obesity rates. Na makes fun of eu (UK teeth), and food.
What Br does, is send death threats to people personally.

See a different. People talk about about countries, but brazillians decide that's fine to go and send death threats.

Shit talking a country is fine by all means, as it means fuck all. Personalyl wishing someone death because of a video game, is fucking weird. It's why Br has the msot hated fanbase across pretty much every game.

Even with india, people shit talk the country and bring up forsaken. Other than that,they can still shit talk any other country however they want. However they dont send death threats.

with turkish players, in eu they're just the most toxic players you can run into on ranked. irl they're lovely people in my experience. However in diamond-radiant rank, they're toxic as fuck.

The hate FR,GER, and Uk have for eachother isn't banter. The amount of hate I've seen thrown around between the three countries is insane. With turkey, peopel just hate when we get turkish players on our servers with 70 ping, when they have their own. Not their fault that in higher elos their servers of dead. I dont blame them for it. Some people do.

that and in EU turkish people are by far the most toxic people I've ran into. In irl they're some of the nicest people I've met. Online they're the opposite.

I haven't had any real interactions with Brazilians, so I've never seen hate go towards it. In siege peop[le used to meme about them because they were behind the meta, and only had one good team. Right now I'd say they're the only region actually worth watching in that game.

"We trained several maps out here and nobody even warned us against Acend itself, in Riot's exploit bug it hasn't clarified that this camera was buggy, what I see is that they should have paused the game and warned us simple!"

Hopefully they come back stronger in the LB. They deserved the win against acend today/yesterday

Do you expect staff to not research other teams though? x10, who is in their group did the bug and got punished.

Now VK should not have ff the map because of it. They were the better team in the match by far. Just dont make excuses for him not knowing it was an exploit. I can understand him saying he thought if he changed the cam up a bit so it's not the exact same as the one used by x10, then fair enough. It was pushing it. However saying he wasn't aware at all that it was an exploit, is just feigning ignorance.

aah ye lol. Get them mixed up at times lol. 3am isn't helping with no sleep either haha.

VK was playing insane. It's a shame they had to ff the map. This worked for my pickems, but I got them winning LB. Hopefully this anger fuels them to destroy the lower bracket.
It would be suck a mistake if they go out beacuse of something like this. Acend just got so lucky given they were playing like ass on breeze.