How many will retire to pursue streaming carrer over being pro player?
Shahzam even told that they can earn more money by just hosting VCT matches or Champions than playing itself that makes him not sure to compete anymore
Dude even said 300k money is low for them
I don't know why people hate underdeveloped regions like PH, BR, India, these guys are gaining at most 300 dollars per month in lower tier1 (in their region) and still trying their best without NASA PC that everyone from NA has, Monitor cheap asf, everything is way more cheaper in NA for pursue gaming carrer... but people some NA people still thinking themselves above any other region.. dude, with all these investment is your region obligation to be top and yet you guys still suffering from minor region... damn.
NA Pro Players + Minor Region Future?
When I first started playing fps on pc, I was playing siege. Gettign 60fps, had a mouse set at 3200dpi and can't change, and a keyboard that was a membrane. It was dogshit, however it wasn't unplayable. At the time I didn't know what was better, so I could only use that. I still hit the top 10% in the world in terms of rank, due to my own grind.
ofc anything can influence it. However someone saying someone had a better mouse, is a bullshit excuse. Hell, a r6 pro in russia was playing his pro games on a dinning chair. There was a interview with a french player who was sitting on the floor with his monitor on a small table in his dorms. He still qualified for pro league, the russian pro still played in pro league to a high level.
Hardware once able to get a stable 60fps, is fine to play. If you want more, then ofc it's an advantage. however someone with 60hz monitor can still beat someone on a 240.
Better gear can only take you so far though.
If someone is better than you at a game, no amount of gear can make you better. Using gear as an excuse is just stupid.
Sure they can give you an advantage. However at the highest level of competition, it wont make a difference. Unless some dude is playing a crt monitor, I doubt they'd lose because their gear wasn't good enough. If they cna get a stable fps at 60, which pretty much anything can. Then that's enough to grind.
tldr;
Better gear doesn't inherently make you a better player. If someone had talent, they can achieve as much as someone with gear. Talent > gear
Yeah but in Online era even ping matter, in valorant you can be radiant with 60hz if you have a low ping and not playing duelist. (I know some main duelist with 60hz but It's hard to entry with 60hz tbh).
My main point here is.. during online era (past years) people who had better gear + good connection could easily get their spot in Valorant, I hope LAN era to remove some of these ProNET players.
I made this post cause I just saw a post here where people posted their setup and everyone from Minor Region seems to have poor gears in a game like FPS that a single kill can change entire game.. It matter a lot. I just feel sad for them, looks hard to follow their dreams living in these regions and they still get FREE HATE for playing bad sometimes.
Bro he will never get a career out of streaming, any views he gets rn are because hes on top 1 valorant team Sentinels. He has a fake toxic personality and isnt even high skill (some people watch pugs for good pug player gameplay idk?). I guarantee you if he retired he would get no views within 6 months.
He'd still have views. Weirdly enough new fans in val actually enjoy him. Idk, I find him cringe and hypocritical from all the shit he did in cs.
Pugs are good enough to make a streaming career. Shroud has the personality of a snail, but was getting 50k before he left for mixer. He never achieved anything huge in CS, other than a DH. However he was a pug god. He had a highlight every match. That's what gets people to play.
Also not many people know his personality from before val. So what they see, is his fake personality that they believe is true.
People see that as content.
KingGeorge, in rainbow six siege. Dude is garbage at the game, but malds and it becomes content.
Also as much as I dislike shahz, I can't say he isn't good in pugs. Statistically he's good, and has been high radiant since game launch. Even performed at the top level, putting up good results.
We're literally in no place to say if he's bad, or good. He can make a career out of streaming as much as I dislike him. He's getting 10-15k viewers, and as long as you can have a stable 2-3k, you can make a decent living off that. That's enough viewers to get a deal with an org as a content creator, and then you get a salary aswell.
before sen started winning he was around 600 or so viewers. This was also when tenz was at around the same, while wardell was at the peak.
However he's grown, and his brand has grown. Right now he's one of the highest viewed pro players when it comes to streaming. Just a shame people have forgotten his past, and the shit he got away with.
Also all it takes it to be the best at one point, and you can keep making a living off it.
I also dont think he's the best jett, or sova player. However he did coach, and igl a team to winning the first lan. Even if it was Tenz popping off. Can't take that away from him. Dude is a smart player, and most likely will contain a decent viewership for a few years.
Perfect example of someone who was washed but has a viewership to live off. Hiko back on cs, and jasonR. Both have a decent viewership while streaming, enough to easily make a good living off.
JP isn't a poor country incase you didn't process that you inbred. Your logic is flawed either way. If NA 13-0 every team you'll say: "NA only wins because they have lots of money" If NA lose to minor regions you say "NA should win because they have lots of money." You logic proves that you only made this post to hate on NA and just that.
https://www.vlr.gg/event/520/champions-tour-north-america-stage-3-challengers-1/open-qualifier
There are literally 30+ teams here that are unsalaried
I know, but I'm sure most of them have their setup complete?
My main point is here is some region have only 1-2 teams who get paid, like Japan. CR + ZETA only.
Even being unsalaried most of NA can still compete at high level because they don't pay 3x price for any gear or things like that plus their connection is way way more better during ONLINE ERA (past years)
I referred about VCT but only first 8 teams, not everyone who participated.
Even in JP some semifinalist almost quit from VCT cause he needed to find a work cause he don't get paid any $ by playing it.
Well, last time a large org went to india one guy single handedly tainted any change of a large Na org going back there, aswell as killing the cs scene that was slightly developing.
Hecz even said he'd never invest in india again after the forsaken shit, and it's unfortunate.
All I'm trying to say here, is if you're getting paid 30k a month. Someone with talent could be better than you. having better gear, or more money. It doesn't make you a better player. You have a higher chance of improving, but in the end the better player will be better regardless of their equipment.
It's like that for the majority of people who aren't signed to a t1 org. Smaller regions are a bit different as esports hasn't taken off there. However that doesn't mean developed regions have an obligation to be top. Someone can play for 15hours a day, and still not be as good as some 15yr old in the slums of china playing on a 7yr old dell xps laptop.
At the end of it, talent and hard work beats out developed environments. It's not as easy to beat them, but it is for sure possible.
Brother.. Like, my point here is.. Even SepiaMars from VCT almost retired because he could not make ANY MONEY from playing VALORANT, he has uncertain to even play semifinals because he needed to find a work... tell me WHO would miss a VCT SEMIFINALS to try to find a work? none I guess.. I'm saying that developed region tier1 everyone get paid compared to some tier1 from minor region, how could you achieve your dream to be a pro player if you cannot grind 8h per day and need to work?
Japan work is like 10h per day
I'm just saying about Japan because I have many friends from Japan because I play in JP server.. but It's only Japan!
even Japan being considered "rich region" for you their players suffers, can you imagine HOW MUCH MINOR REGION SUFFERS THEN?
Like India, BR, idk.
We mentioned japan because you were talkign about regions not affording gear.
Every region started off at some point where it wasn't viable to play full time. Even now it's incredibly hard. It's why most people who grind up are around 18 or so, and live at home.
go watch wardells interview where he talked about his relationship with his mom. He spoke about dropping out, and pretty much not having a real realtionship with his mom because of it.
People make sacrifices to try to be the best. It's unfortunate that more orgs aren't going to undeveloped regions. However what reason do that have to do that? There's no sponsors, as there's no viewership.
When mang0 was grinding SSB, he was earning a living off purses, and not an org. That's what it started like when esports was only getting big.
People meme on performances no matter what. IF tenz performs bad, people shit talk. IF munchkin performs bad, people shit talk.
It happens in every single sport. It's because people assume that the best of the best in the world, should be consistent. They set impossible expectations on players, which is stupid.
Nobody hates minor regions because of performance. People shit talk performances, but I highly doubt anyone genuinely hates other regions because of the players. Most hate regions because of fans over the players.
alot of league pros say NA is exactly like that or atleast some NA teams,usually players who go to NA from eu for example usually care more about the money and becoming famous than being the best because the salarys are so high and its alot easier to become a semi succesful streamer in the NA scene if you play in a big org
tbh branding yourself is the best choice to go for. Esports you only have a short career, on average people tend to fall off around 25. you can stay on and try to be the best, but time will get you. Look at Allu, or KennyS. Both used to be insane, and just slowly fell off and off. Allu stuck around far too long, and didn't build a brand for himself streaming. same with KennyS. Didn't steam a lot, so he never had a constant viewership.
Now look at tarik, who streams often. He was the best in cs at one point on NRG, but started making a brand for himself. He has a career streaming, as he most likely wont go pro again.
It's also why a lot of sports stars go into making clothing brands. It's a source on income as they know their time playing is limited.
He was popular because he built a brand while grinding. It's one of the biggest mistakes pro players do. They will not stream, just grind the game off stream, and do scrims. Once their career competing is over, they have nothing to fall back on.
Building a brand while grinding to be the best, is the best choice and the main choice a pro player should go.
Right now the best person doing so, is s0m. Asuna started it, other pro players are also doing it. It's a smart safety net.
Probably NA will fall?
I mean s1mple from CS doesn't even stream a lot he try to earn most of his money by winning tournaments
Some Pro Players from CS doesn't even try to stream, but looks like only NA players try to brand themselves and try to live by streaming instead being a pro player.. being pro player for them is like.. nothing?
I hope some talented kids show up and remove any pro player how doesn't have passion for competition.
Edit: It's not these players fault, 99% would do the same as them. streaming >>> being pro, nowadays. (about money)
OKay, do you think s1mples money will last him forever? Look at any soccer player. They earn millions in their career, and they end up spending it, and have nothing to fall back on.
Building a brand is smart. TenZ has done a fantastic job at it. Pengu on siege did a fantastic job at it. They both did it whilst being the best.
You say only NA players do it? Is scream not building a brand? Are Br players not streming while playing?
mentioning s1mple or zywoo is a mute argument. They're both freaks of nature when it comes to CS. They'll be around for years, and even then. Both have such a huge following from being literally the best players the game has ever seen.
Also look at get right atm. he set the standard for cs for years, and where is he now? He didn't build a brand, and chills with 3k viewers while playing cs.
Tarik doesn't have the legacy get right has, but he gets double, if not triple his viewers, and most likely a more stable income.
you need to realise that building a brand doesn't mean you dont have the competitive edge to be the best. You can only scrim so many hours before it becomes pointless. Just streaming the game being spammed, is still grinding the game. Tenz is the exact example of this. Dude grinds the game, streams here and there. He's one of the most consistant people in the game atm.
Everyone should be thinking of the potential of it though.
Being a pro you have a huge reach to gain new followers/fans. Streaming is a way to cement that into an income after you retire.
Also streaming doesn't mean you're not focusing on being the best. Most players would scrim for 3-5 hours or so, and then the rest of the day they'd play the game. Why would streaming while doing it, harm their career. To me, it's a smart choice to go for. However, it isn't great when they start prioritising the stream, over competing.
imho, if you're a pro player and not trying to think of a failsafe in case your career fails. You're either naive, or overestimating how long you'll be around, and how much money you'll make.
I'm going to try to explain with my shitty English
But look to Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo.
They don't go to party, they don't drink, they live for SOCCER it's passion for them. (That's why they're good)
But you can be a Professional Soccer and try to get money from social media by trying to get attention, trying to play "beautifully" doing fancy things, entering discussions to generate media, etc.
One side lives their passion by soccer, his live is for soccer.
Other one, lives for money, media, soccer is just like.. "I'm good enough to be here and I can't be No.1 so I will just enjoy my life imo"
CS has all about passion, LoL same.. That's why NA keep falling because most doesn't have true passion for living game itself
Like I said, Mwzera doesn't even streaming because he doesn't have time to give people attention he only focus in becoming better and better, d3ffo rarely does streaming as well because he follows the same path.
Both Messi and Ronaldo have clothing brands.
I will admit, they both have the passion to be the best, and THE BEST. Just like how s1mple and zywoo on cs have insane hours in the game. As an individual, they're amongst the best of all time.
also you're forgetting how many sponsorships ronaldo or messi have done. Can't talk about they do it for the passion only. That's a big fucking cap if I've ever seen one. Shahzam is far from the level of the best individule player in the world. That would most likely fall under yay or tenz. Both of which constantly grind the game, be it on stream, or off.
Shahz i'll compare to beckham. Beckham wasn't the best, but he has his legacy in football. He built a brand around himself throughout his career. he was known as one of the best captains in the world, and one of the best playmakers in history. He also had a huge social media brand surrounding his life.
I'm all fine for people choosing not to stream. However what difference does it make if you stream yourself grinding the game, or not? As long as you're playing the game, and improving your individual level. You can do whatever you want.
you know streaming is not the only way to make a living,all of the pros who made it already have more than enough money to invest in other things that they can easily live their life without working a day because they became succesful from rather being a good player than a intresting personality like kennys,allu etc
They can invest it. It's the same with professional athletes. They earn huge amounts, and can invest it. how many do end up investing it compared to sitting on it slowly decreasing the amount?
Streaming is another way to invest into the future. Being a pro and streaming is free advertisement. The reach you have is huge at that point. It's also free to stream, as nobody scrims for a whole day. The free time is fine to stream in, which most of the current top teams do.
most professional athletes,musicians etc are literally so retarded,they usually spend it because they cant handle the money correctly,anyone smart who earns like over 10k a month knows how to make it last long term,do you think the hundreds of old tier 1 cs players who have retired are working dayjobs atm?
tbh shroud dipping is the best thing he could ever do. Dude retired early, as he was honestly not that special in CS. He became the msot subscribed streamer, and made a multi million deal to swap for a few months. dude is literally more successful than nearly every pro cs player outside of the game.
Brax couldn't really grind to be the best in cs. Banned from valve, he was handicapped in terms of having a prestigious career.
s0m right now spams streams, because what else should he do? You can only scrim so much throughout the day. Most teams would scrim 3-4 hours, what else do they do in that off time? stream the game? or just play the game anyways and not stream. Both are pretty much the same. At least this way they're building a brand, and practicing the game.
I'm not sure about league. Dont follow it too much, so I can't comment on that. I mainly know cs, val, siege.
yeah and the point of this thread is that na players are kinda plastic and not really passionate about the game same way cis/eu,asia and latam etc is because they actually care about becoming the best in the game than just making alot of money,theres nothing wrong with making money but esports is a passion and competition the same way football is for some people so its just looks kinda arrogant that shazam who isnt even bad is considering full time streaming in the middle of a major because he would get more money from that as if the sentinels paycheck and competing isnt enough
I do agree that it's arrogant that he is thinking of leaving despite his current level of game. I'm also thinking from his viewpoint. He's in his late 20s. his career is on a timeclock atm. The recent major has skyrocketed him to 15k viewers, to 30k. I honestly think he might be thinking of it realistically, than going by passion. Passion can only get you so far. In the end passion doesn't pay bills. It can, but 99% of the time it doesnt.
also ngl, I'd like to see the clip of him talking about it. The context before, or if he was memeing does also matter. IF he was serious, it is arrogant as hell to think about it in the middle of a major. It could also be the grinding constantly for 10 or so years, that takes a toll. SeanGares was good enough to keep competing, but he retired because the constant grind was too much. Same with Pengu in siege. He was burnt out of the game and the grind, so he retired. shahzam has been on the grind for over a decade
I feel players like wardell, who is still young. wont think of that as a reason now. Same with Asuna, or TenZ. They're still young enough where their end is no where in site for them. Shaz is getting up there in age, and it's only a matter of time before he dips off.
Yeah, after farm he doesn't even care about competition anymore tbh.
I find so disrespectful of him for saying prize money is low for them (Money is always in his head lol) this money prize would change any other team's life but just because it's low for them they say something like that.
I'm not supporting someone for always prefer money over a passion (FPS gaming) who made him achieve all things he has nowadays
BECAUSE THEY COMPETE IN THIS GAME TO EARN A LIVING.
Why did mwzera stop playing siege and swap?
why did nats leave cs?
why did scream leave cs?
why did every current pro leave the previous game? Because it's not financially stable for them. You need to realise that these people do this for a living.
I get what you're saying. you just need to realise that passion can only get you so far. Why do you think Solo retired. His passion only got him to this point, and he saw it as his time to quit.
It's unfortunate that the smaller regions have to work while playing. However do you think that if they got paid to play, they'd still rely off the money, and that would be their main intention. In the end, everyone is grinding so they can earn a living while playing. PAssion doesn't feed the family. Money does.
Also every member of Sen have a legacy. The first international lan, without losing a map. That in itself is a legacy. Just like Solo had a 107series streak before retiring.
Scream could just be a streamer but he preferred to gain money by competition
Mwzera didn't played siege, he played ZULA (a dead game imo, only famous in turkish ZULA)
Mwzera swap to become the beast that's why he's training like a demon I'm sure of it because everyone from Gamelanders (his team) said it.
But my main point here is passion over money, money will not let you achieve big things that's why in every game NA region fall.
mwzera was a fucking challenger league player in siege bro.
https://play.eslgaming.com/player/13718419/
He didn't make it in siege, so he took his chances at val. These players are coming to val to earn a living and live their dream of playing games for a living.
So far in val, the only people who've openly gone for passion over money, is nitro and floppy. Both are going back to CS, because they prefer it over val. Scream came over to val because he was dogshit the past few years in cs, and would never achieve anything in it again. Love the guy, but he was washed up.
You talk about passion over money. PAssion doesn't feed the family. Passion is great to give you the motivation to grind. However someone thinking of money over passion, on a limited career. Is smart, not dumb.
Also nearly every region has fallen in a game. BR was huge in cs, they fall. They're big in siege atm, they could still fall. EU was big in rocketleague, they fell.
It's not restricted to one region. I will admit more NA players tend to go towards twitch as a means of income, compared to other regions. However it doesn't mean they dont have the passion for the game. It could be them realising that they're tired of competing for nearly 10 years straight. Shahzam has been playing at a competitive level since 2012 or so. 9 years of constantly playing. Not a lot of people make it that long before being burnt out.
https://www.espn.com.br/esports/artigo/_/id/7946678/mwzera-a-historia-do-melhor-jogador-brasileiro-de-valorant <-- Just use translate about mwzera history. Chrome auto translation.
But I got your point It's not wrong to choose money, in every sports is like this.
his youtube has a few videos on siege. So most likely went to zula, to siege, to val. He performed in CL br in 2020, before val.
also a peak example of someone who just went to a specific esport for money. n0ted. He said he only ever played siege professionally for the money. That I find more scummy than someone choosing money in the latter half of their career.
He didn't choose because of money, but because zula died.
If he really wanted money he could just open his twitch live IMO and farm money easily because he's the best player in BR region, he get 5k views easily but he prefer to focus in his gameplay imo that's what I'm saying.
I'm not saying what Shahzam did as wrong.
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