the only must keeps on the roster imo are poiz leaf and mitch, do you think they go back to the roster from stage 2 or something else?
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dignityx3 [#4]Drop xeta and get a more cracked sova and get a better IGL maybe. seems like they lack good strats, structure and the fundamentals, just feels like me watching TSM all over again (when they were trash). TSM's problems were fixed after getting a better sova so yeah. And maybe a new coach.
i agree they need a good igl but xeta has been a really good support player especially in stage 2 i think they just need to get a good smoke/igl player
turkey [#5]i agree they need a good igl but xeta has been a really good support player especially in stage 2 i think they just need to get a good smoke/igl player
Idk in the recent matches he's been underperforming kind of. even in TSM we didnt consider drone to be a problem yet they dropped him and gott Leviathan and look insanely better.
stellar [#9]ngl, xeta has been underperforming lately. and dropping xeppaa could also result leaf to also leave, they are bestfriends and idk how leaf would manage it. they better bring back leaf's raze and maybe put poiz on reyna/phoenix and xeppaa to be their main controller.
plus, it seems like they treat scrims to win, not to improve or be better lol
dignityx3 [#8]Idk in the recent matches he's been underperforming kind of. even in TSM we didnt consider drone to be a problem yet they dropped him and gott Leviathan and look insanely better.
you bring up a great point, but what other sova supports are there to pick up
stellar [#9]ngl, xeta has been underperforming lately. and dropping xeppaa could also result leaf to also leave, they are bestfriends and idk how leaf would manage it. they better bring back leaf's raze and maybe put poiz on reyna/phoenix and xeppaa to be their main controller.
leaf on reyna is insane too he needs to stop playing sage, but he could play raze to give poiz the reyna on some maps. poiz is also amazing on jett seeing the match today
turkey [#13]you bring up a great point, but what other sova supports are there to pick up
Critical maybe?
turkey [#13]you bring up a great point, but what other sova supports are there to pick up
Not too sure myself, but there are probably some insane Sova talents on Tier 2 teams rn that they can scout out, and people on this site probably know about.
turkey [#14]leaf on reyna is insane too he needs to stop playing sage, but he could play raze to give poiz the reyna on some maps. poiz is also amazing on jett seeing the match today
yes, poiz is amazing. but he can't be the first entry. he is not aggressive at all. feels like leaf is used to fast-paced execute that he can't wait for poiz to entry and make space for the team. we can't blame leaf that he was only able to use res once in out of all many because he would entry for them. and xeppaa's kayo didn't help at all.
stellar [#17]yes, poiz is amazing. but he can't be the first entry. he is not aggressive at all. feels like leaf is used to fast-paced execute that he can't wait for poiz to entry and make space for the team. we can't blame leaf that he was only able to use res once in out of all many because he would entry for them. and xeppaa's kayo didn't help at all.
Agree, leaf should be using duelist to entry and let poiz be the second man. Also they only need to be patient, not every new roster will be insane from the beginning, some need more time to develop.
dignityx3 [#8]Idk in the recent matches he's been underperforming kind of. even in TSM we didnt consider drone to be a problem yet they dropped him and gott Leviathan and look insanely better.
He's not been underperformining like CONSISTENLY underperforming. He only had a ONE BAD game where his team looked awful af, and you already think he should be dropped? How about stage 2 quals, did you even bother looking at his performance there?
Edited: Stage 3 ---> 2
stellar [#9]ngl, xeta has been underperforming lately. and dropping xeppaa could also result leaf to also leave, they are bestfriends and idk how leaf would manage it. they better bring back leaf's raze and maybe put poiz on reyna/phoenix and xeppaa to be their main controller.
Could you plaese tell me exactly in which games he's been underperforming or where should I looked for his underperformance? I actually went and looked at his history and except today's game I don't see anything....
turkey [#13]you bring up a great point, but what other sova supports are there to pick up
Did you just agree with the statement that Xepa has been underperfoming?
turkey [#14]leaf on reyna is insane too he needs to stop playing sage, but he could play raze to give poiz the reyna on some maps. poiz is also amazing on jett seeing the match today
Yes playing Sage has restricted Leaf's ability to frag out. The reason C9 shined in stage 2 was because Leaf became the team's primary duelist along with Poiz. His ability to get entry frags and impact frags were huge, so C9 should give him back the duelist slot. C9 could play double duelist on maps where it is viable and Leaf be the single duelist on some maps. I don't know much about Floppy, but he could replace Poiz in the maps where double duelist is not viable.
clocksky888 [#22]He's not been underperformining like CONSISTENLY underperforming. He only had a ONE BAD game where his team looked awful af, and you already think he should be dropped? How about stage 2 quals, did you even bother looking at his performance there?
Edited: Stage 3 ---> 2
Stage 2 was good, he's bad in stage 3. Thats what matters rn
notAGN [#20]as tenz said people feel the urge to run single/no duelist when double duelist can have so much impact. Not putting leaf on a duelist was a crime and xeta just had a bad game no need for roster changes in fact I feel the reason c9 are inconsistent are cos of the roster changes every fkn week
leaf did pretty good on sage actually, it's just that the decision-making from c9 are wack on attack.
If they make any changes it should be a comp and/or management change. The only scenario where they should make a roster change is if a good IGL somehow became available. Like if someone as good as like NaturE or dephh became available or if some other great IGL from another region was moving to NA, then they should at least think about a potential roster change. Other than that I think management needs to work with mitch to improve his IGLing and to create a slower playstyle. The worst thing i saw from C9 yesterday was that whenever they did a fake, their lurk player got no map control at all. On Icebox they would fake B and their lurk would just be sitting outside of A instead of pushing up and getting info. The issue for C9 is definitely on the tactical side and luckily they have a lot of time before the Last Chance qualifiers.
turkey [#13]you bring up a great point, but what other sova supports are there to pick up
Critical and Aleksandar
dignityx3 [#26]Stage 2 was good, he's bad in stage 3. Thats what matters rn
Alright then, C9B failed to qualify at 3rd stage into the Main event from 1st challengers, losing to RISE 2-0 in bo3:
It has happened clearly in STAGE 3 and to me it looks like you haven't done enough research here as Xeta is a solid mid tab with a higher combat and damage than your main duelist(just the point - nothing bad on Xeppaa). He also managed to clutch a 1v1 saving you the round. So, how can you claim that he is bad in STAGE 3 as he clearly isn't? BTW if you look closely, whole C9B team performed awfuly and all should be included in the convo, not just poor Xeta.
That brought them into 2nd challengers qualifications where they failed to qualify to the Main event losing to LG 2-0 in bo3 AGAIN:
Xeta performed below his expectations but that is only ONE GAME, bro. C9B look awful in both games so maybe it's just not Xeta's fault but the whole team's problem - something we don't know about yet? Or maybe it was Xeppa's fault that they failed to beat RISE as he underperformed on main duelst for the team back then in the same STAGE 3? Floppy has gone already too....
In STAGE 2, C9B played way better Valorant reaching upper and lower finals beating NV etc + putting fights against top teams where Xeta had been their second best player. Now, they can't go past RISE and LG and all that is because of Xeta's ONE BAD GAME, right? Is that really your argument or am I not seeing something that is not there in the first place? Xeta is getting blamed for not qualifying where their main duelist was underfraging vs RISE but of course we will still find the proof for Xeta's inability to carry on a intitator like SOVA in his recent game with C9B, disregarding his hard work through STAGE 2.
PATHETIC, that's what it is.
Sorry but it's just everytime I hear someone is bad, not many even try to support their claim on here, if any at all - just air talks, as usual.
clocksky888 [#34]Alright then, C9B failed to qualify at 3rd stage into the Main event from 1st challengers, losing to RISE 2-0 in bo3:
It has happened clearly in STAGE 3 and to me it looks like you haven't done enough research here as Xeta is a solid mid tab with a higher combat and damage than your main duelist(just the point - nothing bad on Xeppaa). He also managed to clutch a 1v1 saving you the round. So, how can you claim that he is bad in STAGE 3 as he clearly isn't? BTW if you look closely, whole C9B team performed awfuly and all should be included in the convo, not just poor Xeta.
That brought them into 2nd challengers qualifications where they failed to qualify to the Main event losing to LG 2-0 in bo3 AGAIN:
Xeta performed below his expectations but that is only ONE GAME, bro. C9B look awful in both games so maybe it's just not Xeta's fault but the whole team's problem - something we don't know about yet? Or maybe it was Xeppa's fault that they failed to beat RISE as he underperformed on main duelst for the team back then in the same STAGE 3? Floppy has gone already too....
In STAGE 2, C9B played way better Valorant reaching upper and lower finals beating NV etc + putting fights against top teams where Xeta had been their second best player. Now, they can't go past RISE and LG and all that is because of Xeta's ONE BAD GAME, right? Is that really your argument or am I not seeing something that is not there in the first place? Xeta is getting blamed for not qualifying where their main duelist was underfraging vs RISE but of course we will still find the proof for Xeta's inability to carry on a intitator like SOVA in his recent game with C9B, disregarding his hard work through STAGE 2.
PATHETIC, that's what it is.
Sorry but it's just everytime I hear someone is bad, not many even try to support their claim on here, if any at all - just air talks, as usual.
Actually the past 3-4 games he's been bottom of the leaderboard/ 2nd bottom of the leaderboard. Either way stats don't speak out the entire truth, as I said above. Did we think that tsm drone was a problem based on the stats? no. But clearly it had something to do with behind the scenes, his comms/util usage not being good enough since he mained phoenix initially. Replacing xeta COULD definitely be a good solution to C9's problems. Did I ever say it was all because of xeta's bad game? You're putting words in my mouth bro.. you sound very ignorant lmao. Literally said that they lacked fundamentals, structure, and good strats too. Replacing the IGL might be a valid option as well like I said.
Basically yeah you can't read lol. And again, his work in stage 2 doesn't matter at all if he's still underperforming in Stage 3.
drabr420 [#40]wait mitch is igl??
Last time I checked he is, plus i don’t think they need roster changes they just need to find roles that fit since they keep moving around
cloud9bluefan [#41]Last time I checked he is, plus i don’t think they need roster changes they just need to find roles that fit since they keep moving around
yea xeta had a bad series which was unlucky
dignityx3 [#36]Actually the past 3-4 games he's been bottom of the leaderboard/ 2nd bottom of the leaderboard. Either way stats don't speak out the entire truth, as I said above. Did we think that tsm drone was a problem based on the stats? no. But clearly it had something to do with behind the scenes, his comms/util usage not being good enough since he mained phoenix initially. Replacing xeta COULD definitely be a good solution to C9's problems. Did I ever say it was all because of xeta's bad game? You're putting words in my mouth bro.. you sound very ignorant lmao. Literally said that they lacked fundamentals, structure, and good strats too. Replacing the IGL might be a valid option as well like I said.
Basically yeah you can't read lol. And again, his work in stage 2 doesn't matter at all if he's still underperforming in Stage 3.
Yeah, come on let's look at STATS againts teams C9B had a walk in the park winning each and everyone 2-0(bo3) in STAGE 3. It's just that the 2 most important games so far they LOST, bruvvv. What are you looking in those walk in the park games where Xeta bottom fragged(in 3 out of 9 and 2nd bottom)? What is it there that you found? Did you also find there bottom fraging Xeppa in their 3 games and 2nd bottom out of 9. Does that mean Xeppa has to go because not good enough recently? Floppy left, Xeta needs to go and also Xeppa needs to go now according to your "tough" LOGIC, right? And after all you call me an ignorant, yeah? Just accept and move on... No need to shove me numbers that work against your claims. It's all good but we need a point to critique from otherwise it won't work, you know.
And ofc, thank you again for voicing out how PATHETICALLY you judge players, disregarding their not too far of recent performances.
C9B no doubt has issues as it could be seen either through stats or VODs(watched both losses live), but it is not because of Xeta and not due to Xeppa and even not because of floppy. There could be many takes on their issues but plz leave Xeta out of it, if you plan to use same arguments to diss him like that. They are not even closely valid.
clocksky888 [#43]Yeah, come on let's look at STATS againts teams C9B had a walk in the park winning each and everyone 2-0(bo3) in STAGE 3. It's just that the 2 most important games so far they LOST, bruvvv. What are you looking in those walk in the park games where Xeta bottom fragged(in 3 out of 9 and 2nd bottom)? What is it there that you found? Did you also find there bottom fraging Xeppa in their 3 games and 2nd bottom out of 9. Does that mean Xeppa has to go because not good enough recently? Floppy left, Xeta needs to go and also Xeppa needs to go now according to your "tough" LOGIC, right? And after all you call me an ignorant, yeah? Just accept and move on... No need to shove me numbers that work against your claims. It's all good but we need a point to critique from otherwise it won't work, you know.
And ofc, thank you again for voicing out how PATHETICALLY you judge players, disregarding their not too far of recent performances.
C9B no doubt has issues as it could be seen either through stats or VODs(watched both losses live), but it is not because of Xeta and not due to Xeppa and even not because of floppy. There could be many takes on their issues but plz leave Xeta out of it, if you plan to use same arguments to diss him like that. They are not even closely valid.
"Yeah, come on let's look at STATS againts teams C9B had a walk in the park winning each and everyone 2-0(bo3) in STAGE 3"
Bro he literally went negative in some of them lmao... but yeah obviously they dont matter as much, and like I said, stats arent the whole thing either.
"Does that mean Xeppa has to go because not good enough recently? Floppy left, Xeta needs to go and also Xeppa needs to go now according to your "tough" LOGIC, right?"
Not really, Xeppa got them a lot of high impact frags and clutched vs LG MULTIPLE times with Poiz. He had way more impact than xeta. But its definitely possible that Xeppa COULD be the problem too. You're not understanding that this is all speculation and we have no way of knowing definitively what the problem is.
"And after all you call me an ignorant, yeah? Just accept and move on... No need to shove me numbers that work against your claims. It's all good but we need a point to critique from otherwise it won't work, you know."
You are definitely ignorant. You're repeating the same bullshit talking points which I refuted entirely by clearly telling you that stats aren't the entire truth. If they were, drone would not be dropped, and TSM would still be trash. But here we are, with Leviathan making them look better than ever.
You're arrogant if you think you can factually state that its not because of xeta or xeppaa. It could be because of ANYONE. You dont know what goes on behind the scenes.
dignityx3 [#45]"Yeah, come on let's look at STATS againts teams C9B had a walk in the park winning each and everyone 2-0(bo3) in STAGE 3"
Bro he literally went negative in some of them lmao... but yeah obviously they dont matter as much, and like I said, stats arent the whole thing either.
"Does that mean Xeppa has to go because not good enough recently? Floppy left, Xeta needs to go and also Xeppa needs to go now according to your "tough" LOGIC, right?"
Not really, Xeppa got them a lot of high impact frags and clutched vs LG MULTIPLE times with Poiz. He had way more impact than xeta. But its definitely possible that Xeppa COULD be the problem too. You're not understanding that this is all speculation and we have no way of knowing definitively what the problem is.
"And after all you call me an ignorant, yeah? Just accept and move on... No need to shove me numbers that work against your claims. It's all good but we need a point to critique from otherwise it won't work, you know."
You are definitely ignorant. You're repeating the same bullshit talking points which I refuted entirely by clearly telling you that stats aren't the entire truth. If they were, drone would not be dropped, and TSM would still be trash. But here we are, with Leviathan making them look better than ever.
You're arrogant if you think you can factually state that its not because of xeta or xeppaa. It could be because of ANYONE. You dont know what goes on behind the scenes.
So what? Is that suddenly a CRIME to go negative.... or was that too dificuilt to proceed to the next rounds from there, winning 2-0 in bo3 untill they faced stronger teams on the way ofc?
Xeppa added some good impact vs LG(never said anything) but based on your logic, then where was Xeppa vs RISE? That game was not less important than vs LG. And no, those are not speculations. Those are arguments that excluding Xeta from being the scapegoat in your eyes. As I said if you want to look for issues in C9B, then look but don't point at a player who doesn't deserve such treatment. That's my point to you.
Again you are calling me IGNORANT for my attempts of drggaing you down off those delucional CLOUDS of poor judgment you're currently on. And shoving me TSM Drone's situation as an example has nothing to do with Xeta's accustion from you side. Good job ;)
So, then if you also convinced that the problem could be because of anyone, you should stop spreading bs about Xeta. I will only be happy with it. Also, saying that stats are not the whole thing doesn't make you smarter. Learn to use them when they're needed.
clocksky888 [#24]Did you just agree with the statement that Xepa has been underperfoming?
nah i think xeta is their best possible option rn i was just asking which other sovas would even rival him
clocksky888 [#46]So what? Is that suddenly a CRIME to go negative.... or was that too dificuilt to proceed to the next rounds from there, winning 2-0 in bo3 untill they faced stronger teams on the way ofc?
Xeppa added some good impact vs LG(never said anything) but based on your logic, then where was Xeppa vs RISE? That game was not less important than vs LG. And no, those are not speculations. Those are arguments that excluding Xeta from being the scapegoat in your eyes. As I said if you want to look for issues in C9B, then look but don't point at a player who doesn't deserve such treatment. That's my point to you.
Again you are calling me IGNORANT for my attempts of drggaing you down off those delucional CLOUDS of poor judgment you're currently on. And shoving me TSM Drone's situation as an example has nothing to do with Xeta's accustion from you side. Good job ;)
So, then if you also convinced that the problem could be because of anyone, you should stop spreading bs about Xeta. I will only be happy with it. Also, saying that stats are not the whole thing doesn't make you smarter. Learn to use them when they're needed.
"So what? Is that suddenly a CRIME to go negative.... or was that too dificuilt to proceed to the next rounds from there, winning 2-0 in bo3 untill they faced stronger teams on the way ofc?
Again, showing off your ignorance, marvelous display, putting words in my mouth once again.
"Xeppa added some good impact vs LG(never said anything) but based on your logic, then where was Xeppa vs RISE? That game was not less important than vs LG. "
Recent results >>> You could make a valid argue for xeppa getting better with more experience. Back then he was jett, now he's on support, more value. Xeta, not at all, he' sbeen on support for months, and recently been underperforming, but again, that isnt even my main point.
" And no, those are not speculations. Those are arguments that excluding Xeta from being the scapegoat in your eyes. As I said if you want to look for issues in C9B, then look but don't point at a player who doesn't deserve such treatment. That's my point to you."
Of course its speculation. I said that xeta COULD be the problem. Never said he was. And I provided justifications for it. End of the story.
"Again you are calling me IGNORANT for my attempts of drggaing you down off those delucional CLOUDS of poor judgment you're currently on. And shoving me TSM Drone's situation as an example has nothing to do with Xeta's accustion from you side. Good job ;)"
Damn you're proving me right once again. Of course drone's situation has EVERYTHING to do with xeta's situation. NO ONE thought of dropping drone based on stats alone, even if he did underperform sometimes. LIKE XETA. Thus proving stats arent the entire truth. Behind the scenes, however, it was obvious that drone was the problem. But diid we know that BEFORE dropping him? No. Its the same thing with xeta, its possible.
"So, then if you also convinced that the problem could be because of anyone, you should stop spreading bs about Xeta. I will only be happy with it. Also, saying that stats are not the whole thing doesn't make you smarter. Learn to use them when they're needed."
Im not spreading bs though, I'm stating facts. Stats are not the whole thing, in this specific argument. Obviously I know when to use stats. If your duelist is bottom ACS and bottom fragging for 20 games in a row, including all the important games, OBVIOUSLY he's not suited for that role
dignityx3 [#45]"Yeah, come on let's look at STATS againts teams C9B had a walk in the park winning each and everyone 2-0(bo3) in STAGE 3"
Bro he literally went negative in some of them lmao... but yeah obviously they dont matter as much, and like I said, stats arent the whole thing either.
"Does that mean Xeppa has to go because not good enough recently? Floppy left, Xeta needs to go and also Xeppa needs to go now according to your "tough" LOGIC, right?"
Not really, Xeppa got them a lot of high impact frags and clutched vs LG MULTIPLE times with Poiz. He had way more impact than xeta. But its definitely possible that Xeppa COULD be the problem too. You're not understanding that this is all speculation and we have no way of knowing definitively what the problem is.
"And after all you call me an ignorant, yeah? Just accept and move on... No need to shove me numbers that work against your claims. It's all good but we need a point to critique from otherwise it won't work, you know."
You are definitely ignorant. You're repeating the same bullshit talking points which I refuted entirely by clearly telling you that stats aren't the entire truth. If they were, drone would not be dropped, and TSM would still be trash. But here we are, with Leviathan making them look better than ever.
You're arrogant if you think you can factually state that its not because of xeta or xeppaa. It could be because of ANYONE. You dont know what goes on behind the scenes.
You said they needed a more cracked Sova, A. Idk where they would find this more cracked Sova without poaching Crashies or Effys or something and even then Xeta is already one of the best Sovas out there, teams like GenG or even the team they lost to LG probably have worse Sovas then C9 does currently (Tho both the Sovas on those teams are great as well), so i mean yeah
Asueikah [#51]You said they needed a more cracked Sova, A. Idk where they would find this more cracked Sova without poaching Crashies or Effys or something and even then Xeta is already one of the best Sovas out there, teams like GenG or even the team they lost to LG probably have worse Sovas then C9 does currently (Tho both the Sovas on those teams are great as well), so i mean yeah
I said that as ONE of the possible solutions, yeah. But if you're asking me who would replace xeta, the obvious answer is Sinatraa, in september, for the LCQ.
plebwong [#28]leaf did pretty good on sage actually, it's just that the decision-making from c9 are wack on attack.
He did fine but the problem was a lot of times Leaf was first one in, and that role does not fit Sage as a character especially cuz he barely got to use Rez
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