I think it's already time. I'm tired of watching the same comps every single match. 15 Agents now with Astra, if we start with each team having 1 ban we would still have 13 Agents.
The top Agents right now are obviously Sova and Jett, I would love to see people competing to pick them or banking them.
A pick system should have been implemented a long time ago, at least on the pro level. The fact that teams don't know the enemy team comp until they actually load into the game is really weird. The picking should be like League, where each team picks 1 or 2 agents at a time. That way teams can adapt their team comps going into the game.
Bans could come later though. Maybe by the end of 2021 their will be enough agents for bans.
greedeetv [#4]I mean... how would you adapt picks? Like killjoy instead of cypher if you see an omen (obviously not a good example but you know what I'm trying to say). In what situation would you change the comp?
A lot of teams run different team comps on the same map. G2 for example has run different comps on Haven every single game this year. Also some teams run very unique comps, like Fnatic's Viper comp on Bind.
Adding a draft mode where you can adjust your comp mid draft would make preparing against these teams easier. Imagine a team comes up with an anti-strat comp to Fnatic's Viper on Bind and they load into the game and Fnatic aren't even running Viper anymore.
It's not like certain agents directly counter other agents, but sometimes you would like to change up your comp based on what the opposing team is playing. So if G2 is playing their Skye comp you can run a comp you prepared against it, but if G2 is playing their Sage comp then you might want to run a different agent because you've prepared anti-strats involving various agents.
Wealth_and_Taste [#5]A lot of teams run different team comps on the same map. G2 for example has run different comps on Haven every single game this year. Also some teams run very unique comps, like Fnatic's Viper comp on Bind.
Adding a draft mode where you can adjust your comp mid draft would make preparing against these teams easier. Imagine a team comes up with an anti-strat comp to Fnatic's Viper on Bind and they load into the game and Fnatic aren't even running Viper anymore.
It's not like certain agents directly counter other agents, but sometimes you would like to change up your comp based on what the opposing team is playing. So if G2 is playing their Skye comp you can run a comp you prepared against it, but if G2 is playing their Sage comp then you might want to run a different agent because you've prepared anti-strats involving various agents.
Edit: I forgot to mention that some agents do actually soft counter others. For example, Sova ult can destroy Killjoy ult. Sova can shoot a recon dart into Vipers ultimate. Brimstone's ult counters Sage ult, etc. So that is another thing to think about during draft or when people are theory crafting comps.
Wealth_and_Taste [#5]A lot of teams run different team comps on the same map. G2 for example has run different comps on Haven every single game this year. Also some teams run very unique comps, like Fnatic's Viper comp on Bind.
Adding a draft mode where you can adjust your comp mid draft would make preparing against these teams easier. Imagine a team comes up with an anti-strat comp to Fnatic's Viper on Bind and they load into the game and Fnatic aren't even running Viper anymore.
It's not like certain agents directly counter other agents, but sometimes you would like to change up your comp based on what the opposing team is playing. So if G2 is playing their Skye comp you can run a comp you prepared against it, but if G2 is playing their Sage comp then you might want to run a different agent because you've prepared anti-strats involving various agents.
Both fair points. Maybe things will change after this year for champions when (hopefully) teams will meet each other in the same location.
Wealth_and_Taste [#3]A pick system should have been implemented a long time ago, at least on the pro level. The fact that teams don't know the enemy team comp until they actually load into the game is really weird. The picking should be like League, where each team picks 1 or 2 agents at a time. That way teams can adapt their team comps going into the game.
Bans could come later though. Maybe by the end of 2021 their will be enough agents for bans.
Agreed 100%
Wealth_and_Taste [#3]A pick system should have been implemented a long time ago, at least on the pro level. The fact that teams don't know the enemy team comp until they actually load into the game is really weird. The picking should be like League, where each team picks 1 or 2 agents at a time. That way teams can adapt their team comps going into the game.
Bans could come later though. Maybe by the end of 2021 their will be enough agents for bans.
They will most likey do this in the future but 15 champs is still to little they need atleast enough of the "same" agents that both team will still get the utility needed to win the game.
The problem with that is that agents are not counters to other agents. And the plethora of agents is their compliment individual and team playstyle.
If you wanna see different comps then you would need to see different metas.
NA games and EU games are very different in terms of comps etc. NA teams don't run breach/sage while EU teams don't run phoenix/reyna
greedeetv [#7]Both fair points. Maybe things will change after this year for champions when (hopefully) teams will meet each other in the same location.
If a team picks Cypher, the other picks Killjoy or Sage. If a team picks Jett, the other picks Reyna, Raze, or Yoru, if a team picks Sova the other has to pick Skye, and the life goes on, one agent is better than the other, but if you get the Sova instead of Skye you will probably lose the Jett, so the teams have to think about that. In my opinion it's already time.
hekzy [#10]The problem with that is that agents are not counters to other agents. And the plethora of agents is their compliment individual and team playstyle.
If you wanna see different comps then you would need to see different metas.
NA games and EU games are very different in terms of comps etc. NA teams don't run breach/sage while EU teams don't run phoenix/reyna
But it would make things more interesting, getting jett first pick against TSM and making wardell play another agent. Getting Sova first pick against sentinels and making sinatraa play another agent, that kind of mind games would be great imo.
henzz [#11]If a team picks Cypher, the other picks Killjoy or Sage. If a team picks Jett, the other picks Reyna, Raze, or Yoru, if a team picks Sova the other has to pick Skye, and the life goes on, one agent is better than the other, but if you get the Sova instead of Skye you will probably lose the Jett, so the teams have to think about that. In my opinion it's already time.
You're misunderstanding slightly, what he's trying to say is that there is still freedom to pick whichever agent you want, you can just see which agent they pick as well so you can develop strategies.
greedeetv [#13]You're misunderstanding slightly, what he's trying to say is that there is still freedom to pick whichever agent you want, you can just see which agent they pick as well so you can develop strategies.
Yeah, but I don't agree, being unable to repeat the agent would make the pros obligated to learn more than one agent, we would see Wardell for example strugling on other agents or sinatra forced to play skye instead of sova, that would be so nice to see... Teams having to decide, picking agent first, map, or choosing side, so many mind games would become possible. I love that ideia.
hekzy [#10]The problem with that is that agents are not counters to other agents. And the plethora of agents is their compliment individual and team playstyle.
If you wanna see different comps then you would need to see different metas.
NA games and EU games are very different in terms of comps etc. NA teams don't run breach/sage while EU teams don't run phoenix/reyna
Agents are not counters to other agents
This part is true and would be a decent reason to not have draft agent picks. But it still isn’t a reason to not have agent bans. Bans should be in place to break the meta and force teams to be more adaptable.
henzz [#14]Yeah, but I don't agree, being unable to repeat the agent would make the pros obligated to learn more than one agent, we would see Wardell for example strugling on other agents or sinatra forced to play skye instead of sova, that would be so nice to see... Teams having to decide, picking agent first, map, or choosing side, so many mind games would become possible. I love that ideia.
Your idea is great, but that's the sort of thing you need when you have like 30+ agents with many agents for each role. I like the sentiment, but I think there needs to be at least a little more depth to the agent pool for it to work.
ideekae [#15]Agents are not counters to other agents
This part is true and would be a decent reason to not have draft agent picks. But it still isn’t a reason to not have agent bans. Bans should be in place to break the meta and force teams to be more adaptable.
imo they should just balance the agents and teams should force players out of their comfort-agents by anti-strating them. Like they have done in EU and Reyna/Phoenix are unplayable.
ideekae [#15]Agents are not counters to other agents
This part is true and would be a decent reason to not have draft agent picks. But it still isn’t a reason to not have agent bans. Bans should be in place to break the meta and force teams to be more adaptable.
If your pick makes the agent unavailable to the other team, I think we should have picks. Being unable to have the same agent in both teams would make the game a lot more diverse and the matches more unique.
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